National Affairs is a publication of the American Enterprise Institute, a conservative think tank. It's important to keep in mind their ideology when reading anything they publish.
Education and Men without Work
161–170 of 342 posts
Re: Education and Men without Work
#162I am trying to figure out when people will realize that a society without healthy men taking charge and pushing forward is a dying society. It's even more obvious when we see other countries whose feminization of men has actually led to the decline of their population. Reading the sterile, cerebral responses here is a bit disconcerting, but expected given the participating audience, because "smart" people assume that…
>> When you tell him "society only needs a small percentage of men." That looks to be a fairly near quote of something I posted earlier and I want to point out that was not what was said (in case you were quoting that). Biologically (not socially) we only need a small percentage of men. Which ties in to the rest of what you are saying directly. Men (biologically) have a greater impetus to try to conquer and to take r…
Biologically, humans shouldn't exist in tribes of greater than like 20 people or some small number.
Socially, we have countries with millions of people living under one flag.
It turns out the hypergamy negatively affects the average man more than the elite man. So how do you build a system the ensures that the vast majority of men don't die off? You must control for hypergamy.
Polygamy is a smaller issue, because the number of men who act in a manner that breaks a society is naturally much smaller than the number of women that can act in a manner to break society.
Take 1000 people. 500 of them are men. 50 of them can show interest to the vast majority of the women, and the women will gladly oblige. So here, we have 50 people (the elite men) that can cause unstable families.
Of the 500 women, each of them is trying to pick the best man given her qualities. So here, we have 500 people that can cause unstable families (all the women).
This would ultimately cause a large society with no control over hypergamy to dwindle into a small population over time. If we believe for a second people are pairing off "because they have matching personalities", we're all going to have a really bad time.
Re: Education and Men without Work
#163> According to the latest monthly jobs report from the Bureau of Labor Statistics, "work rates" for American men in October 2019 stood very close to their 1939 levels, as reported in the 1940 U.S. Census. Despite some improvement since the end of the Great Recession, Great Depression-style work rates are still characteristic today for the American male, both for those of "prime working age" (defined as ages 25 to 54)…
Labor force participation rate. It says in the article.
Sure, but how is that measured and what does it exclude?
Re: Education and Men without Work
#164Earlier quoted context omitted.
>> When you tell him "society only needs a small percentage of men." That looks to be a fairly near quote of something I posted earlier and I want to point out that was not what was said (in case you were quoting that). Biologically (not socially) we only need a small percentage of men. Which ties in to the rest of what you are saying directly. Men (biologically) have a greater impetus to try to conquer and to take r…
Biologically, humans shouldn't exist in tribes of greater than like 20 people or some small number. Socially, we have countries with millions of people living under one flag. It turns out the hypergamy negatively affects the average man more than the elite man. So how do you build a system the ensures that the vast majority of men don't die off? You must control for hypergamy. Polygamy is a smaller issue, because the…
You have some good points but the Scarlet Letter style conclusion scares me.
What I'd like to see is a society that addresses the essential biological needs of men and women without stoning, beheading, drumming up wars or twitter shaming. It's a big project though.
Re: Education and Men without Work
#165Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'd rather the losers of society stay in their house, high and playing video games, rather than trying to impress women and provide a family legacy by engaging in gangster behavior to get money. Also, if society is so plentiful that it can handle a certain percentage of people doing nothing but living for pleasure, why not let them? Work is not valuable except for its product, and if its product is not needed, the wo…
I used to believe that work was only there for what it produced, but now know that that's wrong. Being useful is very important for mental well-being. It gives happiness and reduces anxiety and depression. When I was unemployed, I did volunteer work to keep my spirits up. It's important for people to work or otherwise have some purpose beyond personal pleasure.
Fwiw, usefulness, even as a hikkiNEET, isn't only to be found in formal employment - but I totally agree with you about its importance.
I've known a lot of the sort of people described in the article over the years and one of the big factors that seems to dictate whether you love or hate the infinite free time lifestyle is what you do with that time. Doing nothing but consuming leaves you in a sad spot, while the full-time wiki editors, fansubbers, forum mods and guide-writers do a lot better in terms of self-respect and general mental state.
I think the phenomenon of the NEET is here to stay in rich societies, so I'm hoping that those affected are increasingly able to channel their energies into productive and rewarding outlets rather than drowning forever in vapid consumption.
Re: Education and Men without Work
#166I think male socialization has left many men poorly-equipped to deal with the modern workplace. Prior to the information age, the primary challenges in the workplace were physical or motivational. So an attitude of "be tough and work through the hard times" was effective and allowed you to earn a living. Boorish behavior was tolerated or even celebrated as "male bonding". But as women entered more professions, that b…
What male socialization? Who are our teachers in the United States? Over three-quarters are women, less than a quarter men. And given that recent studies indicate that women teachers tend to rate boys (unfairly) lower than girls for the same performance, that's women's socialization teaching boys how to behave in schools. Societally? Go on, search to see what doodles Google made for Father's Day. Which parent seems t…
Not sure you really understand my point; "male socialization" is simply "the way we raise boys" -- which includes the ways we as a society neglect their needs.
This isn't a "men versus women" thing, but rather a "we need to pay better attention to boys' emotional needs" thing. When you don't, you teach them that their emotions don't matter and aren't a thing they need to manage to have a healthy, happy life.
Re: Education and Men without Work
#167Earlier quoted context omitted.
> stay at home playing video games all day Playing video games is monumentally boring after a short while. I just can't understand people who disappear into them. Even the game I wrote for myself ( classicempire.com ) I rarely actually played, I'd spend my time trying to make the computer AI play better.
I also can't understand it, life is fun and video games get boring pretty quickly. But that's probably why I am not staying at home playing video games all day.
Not for everyone. Some people drew the short straw in life, poor genetics (low IQ/ physical attributes), live in terrible environments, etc. There is more variance among men so more end up on the short end of the stick.
When every attempt at success is multiple times less likely because of those factors it's easy to get lost in games which are designed to feed that sense of achievement.
Re: Education and Men without Work
#168Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't think the two causes listed in the article are actually the causes. I think both are yet another symptom of an underlying problem. I would argue that men doing worse in schooling is likely another symptom of the same issue. I think that the heart of the issue is that more men nowadays feel that they just don't matter. Not to society nor to anyone else. This leads to a situation where they will simply sacrific…
What about the idea that the passing on of power (wealth, social, political) is happening less as people live longer? It would explain why the problem's more pronounced in Japan (long life expectancy, culture of seniority).
One thing to consider: passing of power is happening less in the US because there are so many baby boomers, and our economy may be growing more slowly.
Re: Education and Men without Work
#169This story really needs another graph showing "NOT-IN-LABOR FORCE RATES FOR WOMEN AGES 25-54; 1965 TO 2019". See https://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2016/images/hipple-fig6.png It appears that the non-participation rate for women is about twice as high as for men.
The traditional role for women has been to stay at home and take care of children, and while it's not the majority anymore, a significant amount still choose this path. Also, there's no stigmatisation of women who choose not to work.
> Also, there's no stigmatisation of women who choose not to work.
Eh... ideally not. It's not uniform, but many treat female homemakers as less sophisticated.
Re: Education and Men without Work
#170Earlier quoted context omitted.
Video games are more mentally challenging & stimulating overall than any other task I regularly engage in. Especially Starcraft, which is absolutely exhausting to play competitively. My day to day work as a programmer just doesn't push me mentally very hard. The kind of deep, exhaustive thinking I needed to get through difficult CS classes is unnecessary in most of my work (and the pacing is rather languid, most of t…
Come join us in the D development effort. We have plenty of productive things to do that will push you past your limits. This kind of work is also good for giving your career a boost - this has happened to many on the D team.
This sounds interesting. Can you give any more information?