What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person? • Hacker News Board

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#161

Post by rlucas » Wed, Aug 28, 2019, 11:10 PM UTC

pbreit wrote: post #94

js2 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's same day ACH, but I have no idea how widespread it is yet: https://www.nacha.org/same-day-ach-resource-center Anecdotally, I recently moved my banking to a discount broker and my paycheck is now credited to my account the night before. I don't know if that has anything to do with same-day ACH. Also anecdotally, Ally takes 5 business days (!) to open a CD via ACH even for an already verified bank. Definitely f…

Businesses use ACH extensively to pay each other same-day (and debit consumer bank accounts). But it has never caught on for consumer "push" payments.

One reason why ACH is tricky with consumer accounts is that there are LOOOONG reversal windows (~30 days) whereas the business transfers ("Corporate Credit and Debit") are final in 24-48 hours.

That means for consumer accounts there's a ton more risk of things going sideways well after the money has moved on.

(Source: possibly outdated circa 2011 NACHA rules and transaction types)

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#162

Post by girvo » Wed, Aug 28, 2019, 11:22 PM UTC

brongondwana wrote: post #152

grecy wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Moving from Australia to Canada/US felt like going back in time 20 years when it came to banking. Even ten years ago in Australia I could do more with my online banking than I can today in North America. Checks are for what now?

Moving from Norway back to Australia felt like going back in time 20 years when it came to banking! In Norway I'd get a new bill and enter the code into my banking and it would offer me an option to "automatically approve up to X per month for this vendor". Automatically approved bills didn't get auto paid - but they appeared in the "upcoming bills" when issued, with a pay date of the due date on the bill. I could go…

BPay gets you close with that. Had that for years and years at this point.

Now we have Osko and PayID which is immediate free payments without needing to remember bank account details. It’s neat!

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#163

Post by munk-a » Wed, Aug 28, 2019, 11:25 PM UTC

baddox wrote: post #153

afarrell wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone from the US, though who now lives in the UK, I would feel the need to quality that with the phrase "needless jargon" if I wanted to refer specifically to jargon that could otherwise be described with less industry-specific terms.

So then would you say "jargon" is just any term for something that laypeople wouldn't be familiar with, even if it's the standard/only name for that thing?

I think that's fair - with the exception of self-descriptive names, and acronyms can further obscure understanding, if you say you've got a Self-Contained Underwater Breathing Apparatus sure, it's for... like breathing, underwater... apparently self-contained which I'm not quite certain the significance of but like "Under water breathing thingy" is a very natural interpretation. SCUBA, to contrast, is much more easily recognizable due to pop-culture, but has no naming inherent to it's name, and is generally not written in a way that implies acronym-ness, "Oh, were you wearing your Scuba tank?"

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#164

Post by pessimizer » Wed, Aug 28, 2019, 11:41 PM UTC

KC8ZKF wrote: post #160

tjpaudio wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article is written for people interested in the very specific topic of the technical workings ACH transfers. It seems absurd to me that you would try to write this article to an audience that hasn't even heard of ACH. I think the only thing you are missing is that you are not the target reader.

Fully expanding an acronym the first time it is used is part of standard written English (SWE).

Expanding that acronym wouldn't help. I hate to get into this silly discussion, but we're all having it on the internet. It's easier to find out what ACH is by using the internet than to post a question on the internet asking what ACH is.

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#165

Post by pessimizer » Wed, Aug 28, 2019, 11:44 PM UTC

munk-a wrote: post #107

tjpaudio wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not elitism. ACH is a term that should be familiar to anyone even remotely informed on the topic. It's ok to read articles on things you are unfamiliar with but it is also on you as the reader to educate yourself when you read on topics that you are unfamiliar with. If every detail was explained in layman's terms, reading would be terribly boring and nuanced technical writing would be dead.

But... I've worked with technical writers and PhDs, technical writers (the good ones) can really easily pull analogies out of thin air to help elevate a reader's understanding, I think (maybe due to star trek) that a lot of technical PhDs are quite good at forming comprehensible analogies as well. Usually CS papers are ~40% comprehensible to the vast majority of non-CS people, this differs from more liberal artsy fie…

When I run into something I don't understand in the title of an article, I just look it up on a search engine. When it's the first hit, I read the capsule description, then return to the article. Alternatively, I often decide that I'm probably not interested in reading an article when I don't understand the terms used in the headline.

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#166

Post by afarrell » Wed, Aug 28, 2019, 11:46 PM UTC

baddox wrote: post #153

afarrell wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone from the US, though who now lives in the UK, I would feel the need to quality that with the phrase "needless jargon" if I wanted to refer specifically to jargon that could otherwise be described with less industry-specific terms.

So then would you say "jargon" is just any term for something that laypeople wouldn't be familiar with, even if it's the standard/only name for that thing?

Yes

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#167

Post by tialaramex » Wed, Aug 28, 2019, 11:49 PM UTC

pertymcpert wrote: post #157

tialaramex wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even better is for a community to _own_ a bank. In the UK there are Building Societies. Originally the concept went only like this: If a thousand workers in a town pool their savings to form a mutual Building Society it can use that money to loan someone (one of their number or somebody else) money to build a house. The new house owner's payments on the loan provide good interest on the savings and a profit the socie…

Why would anyone vote to convert? What's the benefit?

As a member of the society you "own" it but you can't sell that to anybody. Demutualising creates a new public company with shares, which naturally go to those owners. The shares in a public company can be sold. The exact rules for how shares are divided among members would have been in the terms of the proposed demutualisation.

I can probably look it up but I received a not inconsiderable sum of money for my shares when I sold them many years later. I presume my parents sold and spent the money very soon after the plan went through. All members received shares (it would be obviously inequitable to propose that only those voting for the deal get shares if the vote passes, I'm not sure if that would be straight up illegal, but it would clearly be immoral).

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#168

Post by tialaramex » Wed, Aug 28, 2019, 11:57 PM UTC

r00fus wrote: post #158

tialaramex wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even better is for a community to _own_ a bank. In the UK there are Building Societies. Originally the concept went only like this: If a thousand workers in a town pool their savings to form a mutual Building Society it can use that money to loan someone (one of their number or somebody else) money to build a house. The new house owner's payments on the loan provide good interest on the savings and a profit the socie…

Building Societies sound like credit unions. Edit: I also nearly witnessed a "carpetbagger" situation at a local credit union (where leadership wanted to become a bank/corporation), which was voted down.

Yes, the credit union is very similar in practice, although there are numerous technical differences. The most obvious practical difference was that originally Building Societies were oriented around this idea particularly of loans for members to buy homes, a worthy goal that is also conveniently economically sound. Credit unions are broader in scope from the outset.

It was perhaps more obvious (especially for the Limited Building Societies) that they've achieved something good if now everybody owns a home, whereas if now everybody has a savings account with the credit union, er... is that better? Maybe?

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#169

Post by thepinkelefant » Wed, Aug 28, 2019, 11:59 PM UTC

Qworg wrote: post #145

djsumdog wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think Zelle is real time. I'm curious if it's the same working group for RTP that was behind Zelle.

Zelle is roughly real time. It is owned by the same company doing RTP.

Not correct . RTP is from theclearinghouse and Zelle is from clearexchange. Zelle came from a mix of banks trying to address only P2P scenarios. RTP goes beyond to B2C and all other combinations .

Re: What Happens When You ACH a Dead Person?

#170

Post by grecy » Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 12:16 AM UTC

brongondwana wrote: post #152

grecy wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Moving from Australia to Canada/US felt like going back in time 20 years when it came to banking. Even ten years ago in Australia I could do more with my online banking than I can today in North America. Checks are for what now?

Moving from Norway back to Australia felt like going back in time 20 years when it came to banking! In Norway I'd get a new bill and enter the code into my banking and it would offer me an option to "automatically approve up to X per month for this vendor". Automatically approved bills didn't get auto paid - but they appeared in the "upcoming bills" when issued, with a pay date of the due date on the bill. I could go…

I was doing that 10 years ago in Australia with BPay...