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The hypersane are among us, if only we are prepared to look

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Re: The hypersane are among us, if only we are prepared to look

#161

Post by [deleted] »

oldsklgdfth wrote: post #126
Erlich_Bachman wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The question was whether they would be able to operate in a society. We did not discuss nor touch whether they suffer or not.

I would like to think that a hyper-rational would opt out of society in general. Not relying on the conventional ways of sustenance that we are accustomed to. One example of this is the survivalist, that lives in nature. One could start incrementally moving towards minimalism, acquiring the training and skills to farm and hurt animals and finally step outside of organized society. This is something I have been thinki…

[deleted]

Re: The hypersane are among us, if only we are prepared to look

#162

Post by ixtli »

nlh wrote: post #16

My interpretation of the point the author is trying to make: The 'hypersane' are those among us who have realized, for better or for worse, that the traditional things that most in a society strive for - material wealth, social status, conformity to social structures, etc. - aren't really the keys to happiness and that when you "awaken" (and become hypersane, I suppose) you realize that along with those things come s…

I’ve also seen this phenomena you describe: a strong desire for a thing you’ve committed to to be true, to the point where you’ll make continued poor and harmful decisions to avoid acknowledging you’ve been very wrong.

Re: The hypersane are among us, if only we are prepared to look

#163

Post by pcstl »

oldsklgdfth wrote: post #126
Erlich_Bachman wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The question was whether they would be able to operate in a society. We did not discuss nor touch whether they suffer or not.

I would like to think that a hyper-rational would opt out of society in general. Not relying on the conventional ways of sustenance that we are accustomed to. One example of this is the survivalist, that lives in nature. One could start incrementally moving towards minimalism, acquiring the training and skills to farm and hurt animals and finally step outside of organized society. This is something I have been thinki…

Spoken like a true resident of the First World.

When progress is so ubiquitous in your environment that it becomes invisible, it's easy to forget that people die of easily treatable diseases in places that don't have so much "technological progress", that people still starve because of a lack of "economic growth", and so on and so forth.

Re: The hypersane are among us, if only we are prepared to look

#164

Post by gnode »

There are two main elements to sanity: having a rational and sound interpretation of reality, and acting in a way which rationally benefit's ones interests.

I think hypersanity would constitute not only a hyper-rational worldview, and to reconcile common cognitive dissonance, but also the ability to integrate that awareness into better self-preserving behaviour (to improve ones safety or efficacy), rather than to respond with depression, terror, self-ostracism, etc.

Re: The hypersane are among us, if only we are prepared to look

#165

Post by crawfordcomeaux »

heavenlyblue wrote: post #147
crawfordcomeaux wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have friends who are doing this. They live on land rent-free which is owned by someone who wishes property ownership wasn't a thing. They grow their own food. They dumpster dive for perfectly good food. They process and eat roadkill deer. These people live fulfilling lives and work to contribute to each others' well-being and the well-being of others. I'm working on finding a similar living situation for my partner…

What happens to the deer population when everyone in the US starts road-killing them for food?

There are literally a whole ecosystems to learn to be interdependent with. Farming is still a thing, too. The deer are simply a single example of a way to eat. Hunting is also a thing. Don't buy into the myths of scarcity and learned helplessness society uses to get people to play along. Everyone's capable of learning how to reconnect with and be an active contributor to nature. We simply have a society that operates competitively with nature, rather than mutualistically, and it shows.

Re: The hypersane are among us, if only we are prepared to look

#166

Post by JoeAltmaier »

pcstl wrote: post #163
oldsklgdfth wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would like to think that a hyper-rational would opt out of society in general. Not relying on the conventional ways of sustenance that we are accustomed to. One example of this is the survivalist, that lives in nature. One could start incrementally moving towards minimalism, acquiring the training and skills to farm and hurt animals and finally step outside of organized society. This is something I have been thinki…

Spoken like a true resident of the First World. When progress is so ubiquitous in your environment that it becomes invisible, it's easy to forget that people die of easily treatable diseases in places that don't have so much "technological progress", that people still starve because of a lack of "economic growth", and so on and so forth.

Actually not so much any more. So-called third world countries have moved decisively in the first-world direction for a century. Of course there's still rationed health care and narrow food choices. But easily-treatable diseases? Starvation? More rare by the year.

Re: The hypersane are among us, if only we are prepared to look

#167

Post by alchemism »

nlh wrote: post #16

My interpretation of the point the author is trying to make: The 'hypersane' are those among us who have realized, for better or for worse, that the traditional things that most in a society strive for - material wealth, social status, conformity to social structures, etc. - aren't really the keys to happiness and that when you "awaken" (and become hypersane, I suppose) you realize that along with those things come s…

There's a famous Zen koan which applies here, I think:

“Before enlightenment; chop wood, carry water. After enlightenment; chop wood, carry water.”

Re: The hypersane are among us, if only we are prepared to look

#168

Post by pcstl »

nlh wrote: post #16

My interpretation of the point the author is trying to make: The 'hypersane' are those among us who have realized, for better or for worse, that the traditional things that most in a society strive for - material wealth, social status, conformity to social structures, etc. - aren't really the keys to happiness and that when you "awaken" (and become hypersane, I suppose) you realize that along with those things come s…

>The 'hypersane' are those among us who have realized, for better or for worse, that the traditional things that most in a society strive for - material wealth, social status, conformity to social structures, etc. - aren't really the keys to happiness and that when you "awaken" (and become hypersane, I suppose) you realize that along with those things come stress, anxiety, the rat race, and, well, a pretty boring existence.

"Society is wrong and bad and you should stick it to the man and do things the way you want" is not a particularly clever or original point. Next to every single teenager thinks themselves very bright for thinking something along those lines. They later figure out life is a lot more complicated than that.

Re: The hypersane are among us, if only we are prepared to look

#169

Post by JoeAltmaier »

crawfordcomeaux wrote: post #165
heavenlyblue wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What happens to the deer population when everyone in the US starts road-killing them for food?

There are literally a whole ecosystems to learn to be interdependent with. Farming is still a thing, too. The deer are simply a single example of a way to eat. Hunting is also a thing. Don't buy into the myths of scarcity and learned helplessness society uses to get people to play along. Everyone's capable of learning how to reconnect with and be an active contributor to nature. We simply have a society that operates…

Sorry, hunter-gatherer never supported a civilization. It took big Ag to feed a city full of people.

The back-to-nature theme is fine for privileged landowning educated people. But the vast majority of everybody everywhere is dependent on the local grocery.

Re: The hypersane are among us, if only we are prepared to look

#170

Post by pcstl »

Based on this article, there is absolutely no way to distinguish "Hypersanity" from just plain old insanity.

Rationality is systematized winning. Unless your actions are benefitting yourself in some significant way, you cannot be considered rational.

However, you cannot determine a person's inner drivers from the outside. Therefore, you cannot tell, based purely on their actions, whether they are winning (where winning is defined purely based on the individual's value system). Therefore, it is impossible to tell if an individual is "hypersane" or insane.

The whole concept is meaningless and sounds like something people would think is "very deep" while stoned.

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