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The Beginning of the End of the Beef Industry?

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Re: The Beginning of the End of the Beef Industry?

#161

Post by artimaeis »

lxmcneill wrote: post #137
chrisco255 wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You made a couple of invalid claims here: 1) Canola oil is one of the healthier oils. 2) Monounsaturated fats help fight heart disease. 3) Naturally occurring trans fat is the same as industrial trans fat 4) Red meat has health risks EDIT, included sources, with comments: [1] Canola oil may have dramatic negative effect on weight gain and brain health: "Effect of canola oil consumption on memory, synapse and neuropat…

Would either of you please be so kind as to cite your sources?

So I can't claim to be an expert in this subject -- I've got an acute interest in it but am no professional.

Regarding monounsaturated fats I was going off of some offhand knowledge -- while the AHA agrees with the claim generally[1], it looks like the truth may be more complicated[2].

Regarding the general un-healthiness of red meats:

* There are [3] numerous [4] studies [5] showing a link to an increased mortality rate.

* Red meat was categorized as Group 2A (probably carcinogenic to humans) by the WHO[6]

If there's more claims I made here that I can help to cite I'd be happy to.

[1] - https://www.heart.org/en/healthy-living/healthy-eating/eat-s...

[2] - https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/features/monosaturated-fat...

[3] - https://www.bmj.com/content/357/bmj.j1957

[4] - https://jaoa.org/article.aspx?articleid=2517494

[5] - https://web.archive.org/web/20120313084043/http://archinte.a...

[6] - https://www.who.int/features/qa/cancer-red-meat/en/

Re: The Beginning of the End of the Beef Industry?

#162

Post by invisiblerobot »

tptacek wrote: post #146
notJim wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe with Impossible Foods, but I don't see anything about RNA here: > The vegan meat substitutes are made from mixtures of pea protein isolates, rice protein, mung bean protein, canola oil, coconut oil, and other ingredients like potato starch, apple extract, sunflower lecithin, and pomegranate powder with a range of vitamins and minerals. Beef products that "bleed" are achieved by using beet juice Just sounds like…

"Veggie burger that tastes better" is kind of a big deal, because (to at least a first approximation) the only reason people don't exclusively eat veggie burgers is that they don't taste better.

People also eat meat because it's a lot more energy efficient. One real burger lasts me for 7+ hrs where a veggie burger maybe 2.

Re: The Beginning of the End of the Beef Industry?

#163

Post by technotony »

notJim wrote: post #124
technotony wrote: post #22

The naysayers in the comment thread are missing the understanding that the fundamental technologies driving this are all moving exponentially. Beyond Meat's innovation came from a Stanford professor who is an expert in RNA molecules (he helped them figure out their protein structure/selection), impossible foods is a synthetic biology company. Exponential techs always underwhelm in the beginning but soon deliver more…

Maybe with Impossible Foods, but I don't see anything about RNA here: > The vegan meat substitutes are made from mixtures of pea protein isolates, rice protein, mung bean protein, canola oil, coconut oil, and other ingredients like potato starch, apple extract, sunflower lecithin, and pomegranate powder with a range of vitamins and minerals. Beef products that "bleed" are achieved by using beet juice Just sounds like…

The science is in picking the isolates. They don't market that science, but it's the reason their burger is so much better than other veggie burgers. The Stanford RNA scientist (and some colleagues) helped them figure out which proteins to focus on and how to modify those proteins based on ph and other conditions to create the taste/texture they wanted. What they are doing is much harder than it looks from the ingredients list. This is one of the scientists who helped: https://profiles.stanford.edu/joseph-puglisi

Re: The Beginning of the End of the Beef Industry?

#164

Post by morning_breeze »

What about milk? The milk industry produces beef as a byproduct. Cows have to calve regularly to produce milk and eventually became beef themselves. In my country McDonalds and other burger producers are the biggest buyers of old milk cows. Their beef might be not good enough for steaks, but still good enough for burgers.

Re: The Beginning of the End of the Beef Industry?

#165

Post by technotony »

AbrahamParangi wrote: post #117
technotony wrote: post #22

The naysayers in the comment thread are missing the understanding that the fundamental technologies driving this are all moving exponentially. Beyond Meat's innovation came from a Stanford professor who is an expert in RNA molecules (he helped them figure out their protein structure/selection), impossible foods is a synthetic biology company. Exponential techs always underwhelm in the beginning but soon deliver more…

Exponential improvement is a very powerful lesson, for sure. Exponential increases in capability or applicability or exponential decreases in cost describe the fundamental benefit of technology. But what exactly is an exponentially superior food?

In this case it's mainly our understanding of protein structure/texture/taste which is a new capability.

Re: The Beginning of the End of the Beef Industry?

#166

Post by odyssey7 »

norswap wrote: post #151
technotony wrote: post #22

The naysayers in the comment thread are missing the understanding that the fundamental technologies driving this are all moving exponentially. Beyond Meat's innovation came from a Stanford professor who is an expert in RNA molecules (he helped them figure out their protein structure/selection), impossible foods is a synthetic biology company. Exponential techs always underwhelm in the beginning but soon deliver more…

About the only technology that has ever improved "exponentially" for any amount of time is CPUs. I kind of get your point, but couldn't you have said "the technology is going to improve" instead?

If we went from veggie burgers this year to lab-grown beef patties in 2021, that would be more of a one-time leap.

Re: The Beginning of the End of the Beef Industry?

#167

Post by fmajid »

p1necone wrote: post #155
notJim wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe with Impossible Foods, but I don't see anything about RNA here: > The vegan meat substitutes are made from mixtures of pea protein isolates, rice protein, mung bean protein, canola oil, coconut oil, and other ingredients like potato starch, apple extract, sunflower lecithin, and pomegranate powder with a range of vitamins and minerals. Beef products that "bleed" are achieved by using beet juice Just sounds like…

I've had a beyond meat burger, I'm curious to hear the opinion of others that have had one too because I thought it tasted terrible . The texture was nothing like real ground beef and neither was the flavour. It wasn't good different either - I'd much rather have a regular bean burger. I feel like it's all marketing and they're just riding the hype wave caused by other better products or peoples desire for one. (I as…

I tried the Imopssible Burger, and it also tasted terrible.

I prefer veggie burgers that don't try and pretend they are something they are not.

The future is vat-grown meat, not ersatz meat.

Re: The Beginning of the End of the Beef Industry?

#168

Post by msteffen »

p1necone wrote: post #155
notJim wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe with Impossible Foods, but I don't see anything about RNA here: > The vegan meat substitutes are made from mixtures of pea protein isolates, rice protein, mung bean protein, canola oil, coconut oil, and other ingredients like potato starch, apple extract, sunflower lecithin, and pomegranate powder with a range of vitamins and minerals. Beef products that "bleed" are achieved by using beet juice Just sounds like…

I've had a beyond meat burger, I'm curious to hear the opinion of others that have had one too because I thought it tasted terrible . The texture was nothing like real ground beef and neither was the flavour. It wasn't good different either - I'd much rather have a regular bean burger. I feel like it's all marketing and they're just riding the hype wave caused by other better products or peoples desire for one. (I as…

I'll bite—I love the beyond burger. There's a burger joint near work that has them and they're now exclusively what I get when I go there

Re: The Beginning of the End of the Beef Industry?

#169

Post by Amezarak »

dao- wrote: post #147
YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> I really cannot believe we eat animals I don't understand this. We are animals. Why is it specially prohibited to us that we eat other animals? Note also that, as animals, we are not plant-eaters: we can't survive on plant matter alone. We are made [1] to eat other animals. We are omnivores, yes? So why is it unethical for us, specifically, to eat other animals when it's not unethical for other animals? __________…

> So why is it unethical for us, specifically, to eat other animals when it's not unethical for other animals? You almost answered your own question. "Unethical" is a foreign concept for animals because they don't even have ethics. Humans do, and these ethics have implications for how you should or should not treat other sentient life.

'Ethics' are just social norms, otherwise known as 'the herd instinct in the individual.' There is nothing special about human ethics, except the level of abstraction we use to rationalize them. Humans are instinct-driven animals like all the rest.

Re: The Beginning of the End of the Beef Industry?

#170

Post by aroberge »

p1necone wrote: post #155
notJim wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe with Impossible Foods, but I don't see anything about RNA here: > The vegan meat substitutes are made from mixtures of pea protein isolates, rice protein, mung bean protein, canola oil, coconut oil, and other ingredients like potato starch, apple extract, sunflower lecithin, and pomegranate powder with a range of vitamins and minerals. Beef products that "bleed" are achieved by using beet juice Just sounds like…

I've had a beyond meat burger, I'm curious to hear the opinion of others that have had one too because I thought it tasted terrible . The texture was nothing like real ground beef and neither was the flavour. It wasn't good different either - I'd much rather have a regular bean burger. I feel like it's all marketing and they're just riding the hype wave caused by other better products or peoples desire for one. (I as…

I've had quite a few and I find them almost on par with burgers made with ground beef. It might depends on how you cooked them.
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