Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018) • Hacker News Board

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#161

Post by schwartzworld » Sat, Mar 16, 2019, 5:31 PM UTC

hellofunk wrote: post #25

> Apple practices tax avoidance using loopholes and lobbying. He’s cherry picking things here that really don’t have anything to do specifically with Apple. Amazon paid zero taxes last year and they had more income than nearly any company in the world. Google is also quite famous for the loopholes it finds. I’m not sure it’s fair to single out Apple specifically for this.

I don't know for a fact, but I'd be willing to bet that Richard Stallman doesn't think you should give Amazon your money either.

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#162

Post by supernova87a » Sat, Mar 16, 2019, 5:32 PM UTC

You can call out a multitude of things to be mad at Apple for. The question is, what alternatives currently available would do any better on the whole, for what you need?

You demand a phone that has all these services and qualities to it. Or websites or apps that you like. What system have you come up with that provides a viable alternative to what exists? All these social media companies thought they could create a self-policing, open, free place for discussion. Surprise, turns out every country/government wants to put restrictions on these capabilities, in a different flavor. Or people want to be paid for things, while others want them for free.

Almost every one of the things on his list is a result of people, users like you and me, doing things that weren't intended to be done. And they had to come up with rules to take care of. Or are what's needed to reach this many people.

Not saying there aren't things on there that couldn't be changed. (and by the way, some of his examples are 10 years irrelevant)

But you're mad at Apple because it reaches more people, and does so while ignoring these (let's face it, minor) concerns that most people don't care -- at all -- about. Ask any of your friends to identify / name even 2 of these issues?

So go invent something different. See how long it is before you come under similar constraints and start having to make rules that someone, somewhere disagrees with.

The actors in a system are servants of the things we want (or can't resist wanting) them to do.

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#163

Post by gatherhunterer » Sat, Mar 16, 2019, 5:40 PM UTC

ashildr wrote: post #153

saagarjha wrote: post #98

The problem I have with Stallman is that he’s usually right, but he is remarkably horrible at coming across as someone with valid opinions. It is disingenuous to come to the table with clearly cherry-picked evidence, and calling companies and their products with stupid names is just childish. There are a lot of problems with companies, and Stallman is very good at recognizing them, but he’s just pretty bad at getting…

He‘s the annoying vegan of free software...

"Annoying vegans" are usually associated with baseless moral grandstanding by their detractors. Someone who meticulously cites their sources and allows those citations to do the arguing for him seems like the exact opposite.

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#164

Post by gist » Sat, Mar 16, 2019, 5:52 PM UTC

saagarjha wrote: post #98

The problem I have with Stallman is that he’s usually right, but he is remarkably horrible at coming across as someone with valid opinions. It is disingenuous to come to the table with clearly cherry-picked evidence, and calling companies and their products with stupid names is just childish. There are a lot of problems with companies, and Stallman is very good at recognizing them, but he’s just pretty bad at getting…

> It is disingenuous to come to the table with clearly cherry-picked evidence

It's a bit like women finding reasons not to like a man (or men in general) or vice versa. [1]

It shows (and I don't know the psych term for it) a very rigid 'good or bad' way of thinking. Life in general is a series of tradeoffs and thinking the way Stallman does just leads to unhappiness. And no question when you become that bitter (in that particular way) you are not happy.

[1] Not sure if Stallmen mentioned or not how Apple and Jobs in particular (at least as reported and popular culture) treated those around him. You know what? I don't care at all about that.

Edit: Note he says 'reasons not to use' he doesn't say 'things that I don't like about Apple'. For that matter he doesn't even say 'reasons I don't use Apple' he is clearly implying that he thinks people in general should not use Apple.

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#165

Post by sexyflanders » Sat, Mar 16, 2019, 5:53 PM UTC

I’d be interested to hear valid alternatives or solutions to the listed problems. For the most part they aren’t unique to Apple.

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#166

Post by gist » Sat, Mar 16, 2019, 5:55 PM UTC

kilburn wrote: post #59

hellofunk wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have not flagged this article, partly because I’m curious to see the debate here. But I’m sure those who have flagged it did so because this article is not objective, this is a very extremist position with a lot of cherry picked arguments that are obviously from a personal bias he has against Apple. Many of the points he is specifically isolating for Apple are quite true of most of the big tech firms.

RMS is an extremist, openly and unashamedly. He doesn't try to hide it, he tries to argue that his extremist position is the morally correct and long-term best for society though. > from a personal bias he has against Apple. Many of the points he is specifically isolating for Apple are quite true of most of the big tech firms. He bashes all big techs for most of those points too. See the links at the top where he com…

He is a bitter and unhappy person. Most likely because he sees others making money in the way that they do vs. how he feels the world should operate.

The fact is though many of the modern day benefits we have as a society came as a result of the less than pure pursuit of money and power.

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#167

Post by AsyncAwait » Sat, Mar 16, 2019, 6:12 PM UTC

mark_l_watson wrote: post #45

+1 Richard Sure, he is cherry picking examples, but there are a lot of examples to choose from. I used mostly Linux at home for about 15 years, then switched to a decade of MacOS. My new laptop is a Linux laptop and I think I will go back to Linux as my main driver. I am really conflicted about cellphones. I was unhappy with the crap ware preloaded on my Verizon Android phones. I am happier with a Verizon iPhone, as…

> Still, I differ from Richards opinions in that I think that Apple and Google do have some good privacy policies in place.

The problem is there have been a lot of scandals as of late of SV companies violating the trust you place in their 'policies'. A policy only works if it's being adhered to also when it's not convenient.

I have a HomePod, but with the mics disabled, (I just wanted a decent wireless speaker that can stream lossless audio). The problem is there's no hardware cutting off the mics, it's only software and considering there run full iOS, it's one OTA away from violating my privacy, without me ever knowing.

There's been the Alexa stories, the smart TV stories - it's a real prospect.

I think that's a relatively scary prospect with these sort of closed systems, especially as 'smart homes' are becoming smarter.

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#168

Post by valuearb » Sat, Mar 16, 2019, 6:19 PM UTC

kilburn wrote: post #51

flyinglizard wrote: post #32

1. Apple takes privacy and data safety seriously. It invests a significant amount of engineering effort into keeping user data safe. It doesn't comply with government requests unless forced, after deploying its vast legal means to hold them back. 2. Other consumer electronics devices aren't built in factories that are any different or better than those of Foxconn. While it doesn't absolve Apple from taking some respo…

1. It does, but do you know what's easier? Not collecting that data unnecessarily in the first place. 2. He does call against mobile devices altogether (see the Cellular Phones section [1]). 3. A company can choose where to conduct business. RMS's opinion is that companies should not conduct business where the laws impose said company to routinely act in ways that are harmful to society. 4. "I know better than them (…

What evidence is there that Apple collects data unnecessarily?

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#169

Post by valuearb » Sat, Mar 16, 2019, 6:21 PM UTC

dana321 wrote: post #69

Recent examples of why not to use apple: 1. Their new keyboards are terrible, and are buggy. 2. Lack of headphone jack on phones. 3. Vast price increases for relatively little new features. 4. Constant upgrading of the OS which breaks half of the software you use.

Constant upgrading of the operating system improves performance (iOS 12) and security. I’ve nit had any apps break from any of their updates.

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#170

Post by pacala » Sat, Mar 16, 2019, 6:26 PM UTC

mark_l_watson wrote: post #45

+1 Richard Sure, he is cherry picking examples, but there are a lot of examples to choose from. I used mostly Linux at home for about 15 years, then switched to a decade of MacOS. My new laptop is a Linux laptop and I think I will go back to Linux as my main driver. I am really conflicted about cellphones. I was unhappy with the crap ware preloaded on my Verizon Android phones. I am happier with a Verizon iPhone, as…

Tip: turn your iPhone screen to black/white, witness significant reduction in screen addiction.

Tip: uninstall any app with gratuitous notifications on the spot. Move off the main page notifying apps that you can’t uninstall: mail, calls, messages. Check notifications on your schedule [once a day], not on the app developer schedule [three times a minute, yay engagement]