Paid $0 in taxes always seems a bit disingenuous to me, since they pay labor and equipment costs that are all indirectly taxed. These companies may not pay taxes in the ways we would like them to, or naively expect them to, but the government still ends up with a lot of money in their coffers on account of them.
Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes
161–170 of 512 posts
Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes
#162Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's not that simple. Companies lobby to keep, even coerce, laws that benefit them and allow these sorts of things to happen. What is the common person, or collection of persons, supposed to do when they are against that kind of force? I believe one way is to actually be involved in politics and get into the seats that govern and make the laws. But it's easier said than done.
The answer is to outlaw lobbyists, it would fix a lot of problems. That, and enact term limits for Congress. That will fix even more.
> The answer is to outlaw lobbyists, it would fix a lot of problems. That, and enact term limits for Congress. That will fix even more.
When you think there are simple answers to big problems it's generally because you don't actually understand the problem.
How would you outlaw lobbyists? Setting aside the fact that it would be unconstitutional, do you think it should be illegal for you to air your grievances to elected officials? That seems to fly directly in the face of democracy. Or should it only be that businesses aren't allowed to lobby? What about a small business that is being unfairly impacted by regulations, or being run out of business by a large company abusing a loophole in the law? Seems like them not having a voice in government would be a path to oligopoly or monopoly. If that's ok, where's the line in which business is allowed to lobby, and how do you keep a large business from simply hiring a small business to lobby on their behalf?
Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes
#163Earlier quoted context omitted.
The answer is to outlaw lobbyists, it would fix a lot of problems. That, and enact term limits for Congress. That will fix even more.
Not siding one way or the other, that will definitely limit the amount of expertise that comes with a Congressman/Congresswoman. Think about it, it takes at least six months for us to learn our jobs, they have to learn about hundreds of things ongoing in the government before they can make informed decisions. You then even rely more on lobbyists (or "experts") who at least generally know what they are talking about.…
I've often thought each section of legislation should have a byline that lists every person who had a hand in drafting it since most legislation is now written by lobbyists and not the actual legislators.
For example, H.R. 5323, Derivatives Fairness Act drafted on behalf of CitiGroup.
Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes
#164I assume this has something to do with the massive amount of debt that fuels Netflix original programming. That being said, our entire tax system is regressive, for both businesses and individuals, when it comes to dealing with it's complexity. A small or medium size business does not have the legal or accounting capability to navigate the tax code as successfully as a company like Netflix can. Similarly, even a high…
Regressive? The top 1% of earners paid the highest tax rate of 27.1%. The bottom 50% had an average tax rate of 3.5%.[1] [1] https://taxfoundation.org/summary-federal-income-tax-data-20...
From your same report: "The share of reported income earned by the top 1 percent of taxpayers rose slightly to 20.7 percent in 2015. Their share of federal individual income taxes fell slightly, to 39.0 percent."
This is the problem people are trying to point out. Yes, poor people pay a lower % of their income in taxes than rich people, because the real number is more important due to the static cost of goods across all income brackets.
The problem is, everyone expects people to pitch in their share, and it feels like the ultra-wealthy and corporations frequently find or create new ways to pay less than "they're supposed to". What anyone is "supposed" to pay in taxes is obviously entirely subjective, but when you hear things like "rich people are making more money while also paying less in taxes" at the same time you're hearing about how our economy is funneling wealth away from the lower and middle classes and into the investor and upper classes, people get annoyed.
Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes
#165Rather than being outraged at the headline, what are the actual details? Why were they able to pay no taxes? Was it due to carried losses or something like that? Anyone mad at a company for not pay taxes is misdirecting their anger. Companies follow the law. If you don't like the law elect different politicians. Don't get mad at companies that follow the law.
What a naive view, frankly. Yes, it's probably perfectly legal for them (and others) to pay single-digit taxes. And they can do so because they can 1) afford expensive lawyers and tax advisors, and 2) lobby congress to protect them indefinitely.
It's unfair, plain and simple. Stop pretending it's right only because it's legal.
Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes
#166Rather than being outraged at the headline, what are the actual details? Why were they able to pay no taxes? Was it due to carried losses or something like that? Anyone mad at a company for not pay taxes is misdirecting their anger. Companies follow the law. If you don't like the law elect different politicians. Don't get mad at companies that follow the law.
Because in a democracy, it is always easier for one bad actor to spend $xyz,000 on lobbying the government to let them steal $10,000,000 from the public, then for 300 million people to organize, and lobby against you stealing 3 cents from each of them. It's an obvious defect of the system. Of course, in 2019, half of those people have been convinced that they'll become rich, if they just let large firms fleece them.
Stopping this sort of bribery is part of the definition of a functioning democracy in my opinion.
You say “in a democracy” but you really mean “in the corrupt US”. Political campaign finance works totally differently in a lot of places.
Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes
#167Earlier quoted context omitted.
The answer is to outlaw lobbyists, it would fix a lot of problems. That, and enact term limits for Congress. That will fix even more.
Not siding one way or the other, that will definitely limit the amount of expertise that comes with a Congressman/Congresswoman. Think about it, it takes at least six months for us to learn our jobs, they have to learn about hundreds of things ongoing in the government before they can make informed decisions. You then even rely more on lobbyists (or "experts") who at least generally know what they are talking about.…
I am not sure they have the required expertise anyway, most of the elected politicians have zero understanding of tech for example, many of them never even used email, the woeful questioning of zukerberg showed how clueless they are.
Career bureaucrats are the ones who run many of hundred things that run the government. Politicians need to provide direction and reflect the will of the people. Hardly need to career politicians for that. Younger representation is critical to make sure the voice of youth is being heard.
Do you think any politician understands the needs of the millennial generation ? Any long term policy like say education enacted now is going to impact the future generations more than anyone else.
Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes
#168Rather than being outraged at the headline, what are the actual details? Why were they able to pay no taxes? Was it due to carried losses or something like that? Anyone mad at a company for not pay taxes is misdirecting their anger. Companies follow the law. If you don't like the law elect different politicians. Don't get mad at companies that follow the law.
Answers from the 10-K: #1: "Excess tax benefits on stock-based compensation": (191,323) #2: "Federal and California R&D tax credits": (140,749) https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1065280/000106528019...
Do we have any idea what Netflix activity qualifies for the Federal or California R&D tax credits?
Would Netflix OSS meet the Seven Tests for Internal Use Software [1] to qualify for the R&D Credit? Or is it likely to be something else? Is this information public?
[1] https://www.ftb.ca.gov/businesses/credits/rd/seventests.shtm...
Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes
#169Can someone explain to me why businesses pay any tax at all. It makes no sense to me that we want to restrict the flow of money through a business. Maybe we could tax cash holdings of a company, but why would you tax any income that ultimately goes to expansion, shareholders, employees? People see these "tax evading" corporations as so evil, but why? Do they really even remotely understand what is going on? I suspect…
Gross income isn't taxed, but profits are.
However, I do agree that the annual basis of corporate taxation creates odd incentives - if on December 31st a company finishes the year with $10 million in cash, and on January 1st they spend $9 million, they will still pay tax on the $10 million, while if they spent it just a few hours before, they would have just paid tax on $1 million.
Estonia's corporate tax system seems more sensible to me; profits are untaxed until distributed to shareholders, therefore a company can accumulate as much as needed for more long-term spending.
The $9 million in spending will be deducted for the year's taxation period of course, but that leads to the situation of the company paying say, $3 million in tax one year, then $0 in tax for the next period, which seems similar to Netflix's case as per the article.
Re: Netflix Posted Biggest-Ever Profit in 2018 and Paid $0 in Income Taxes
#170Rather than being outraged at the headline, what are the actual details? Why were they able to pay no taxes? Was it due to carried losses or something like that? Anyone mad at a company for not pay taxes is misdirecting their anger. Companies follow the law. If you don't like the law elect different politicians. Don't get mad at companies that follow the law.
>Companies follow the law. If you don't like the law elect different politicians. Don't get mad at companies that follow the law. If a company is dumping waste into a lake and it is not against the law to do so, it is then wrong to get mad at the company? What if this is the behavior of all companies in the area? They all need to dump waste in the lake in order to remain competitive. Is it wrong to become outraged at…
In seemingly every one of these cases of "corporation doesn't pay TAXES!", it's more along the lines (to use your analogy) of:
in 2017, Netflix dredged out a canal to allow access to another waterway.
in 2018, they added concrete to the new shoreline to prevent erosion due to the newly created canal.
2019 headlines: In 2018, netflix dumped over 18 bazillion tonnes of concrete into lake nature!
It's clickbait, almost every time.
Are there "loopholes" (incentive programs) that companies take advantage of? Of course there are. One might argue that those tax incentives are why the United States has one of the strongest economies in the world.