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More Google Employees Are Losing Faith in Their CEO's Vision

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Re: More Google Employees Are Losing Faith in Their CEO's Vision

#161
post #63

Don't discount the massive increase in the number of employees. The more people you add, the more the culture dilutes. It becomes impossible for employees to feel like they're part of single a tribe with a clear goal. Factions develop, tensions mount, and you get angry employees leaking confidential information constantly. Most of the negative press the public has heard about Google in the past year is a direct resul…

I used to work a corporate job in an investment bank with around 30k employees. The majority of those employees were politicking chameleons with little productive output and a disproportionate salary. I used to hope that large innovative tech companies were different. From what I hear on HN it's becoming clear that that's not the case. It's almost as if the "largeness" of a company allows the non productive people to…

Now imagine what government jobs must be like considering their size.

Re: More Google Employees Are Losing Faith in Their CEO's Vision

#162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work for cloud products. I cannot say much about others, but at least urs is the best technical infrastructure leader but not a good choice for cloud leader. Many people on customer engineering side also share the same feeling with me. Business is complicated. You cannot be narcissus forever.

I'm considering applying there. Any hint/help? username @ gmail. Thanks.

[deleted]

Re: More Google Employees Are Losing Faith in Their CEO's Vision

#164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work for cloud products. I cannot say much about others, but at least urs is the best technical infrastructure leader but not a good choice for cloud leader. Many people on customer engineering side also share the same feeling with me. Business is complicated. You cannot be narcissus forever.

I'm considering applying there. Any hint/help? username @ gmail. Thanks.

[deleted]

Re: More Google Employees Are Losing Faith in Their CEO's Vision

#165
post #63

Don't discount the massive increase in the number of employees. The more people you add, the more the culture dilutes. It becomes impossible for employees to feel like they're part of single a tribe with a clear goal. Factions develop, tensions mount, and you get angry employees leaking confidential information constantly. Most of the negative press the public has heard about Google in the past year is a direct resul…

I used to work a corporate job in an investment bank with around 30k employees. The majority of those employees were politicking chameleons with little productive output and a disproportionate salary. I used to hope that large innovative tech companies were different. From what I hear on HN it's becoming clear that that's not the case. It's almost as if the "largeness" of a company allows the non productive people to…

David Graeber have a thing or two to say about exactly this:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.vox.com/platform/amp/2018/5...

I’m inclined to view this almost as a basic income type situation.

Much can be automated away, but what do we end up if we do that today? We need to find meaning in life other than money for a whole bunch of non-nerds.

Re: More Google Employees Are Losing Faith in Their CEO's Vision

#166
post #124
post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All corporations grow, decay and rot on the similar trajectories, so in this sense it's similar. I worked at MS at this time, and I think BigG now is like MS in 2003 roughly speaking. I'm waiting for miniggl to appear, then the circle will be complete. :)

Even with my limited insight I can tell that they were and still are vastly different companies.

Agree. And the next Google which is born after, say 15 years, will be a vastly different company.

Re: More Google Employees Are Losing Faith in Their CEO's Vision

#167
post #8

Sundar is neither a founder nor has been a practicing Engineer. That's gotta hurt a company like Google which is mostly Engineering driven. I guess Google at this point just keep churning through systems because Engineers are incentivized to show impact and rarely end up creating new good products. Adding tons of new engineers is also probably hurting their overall quality and velocity.

I'm not a Googler but read that Pichai oversaw the growth of Chrome browser from minor player to the dominant position it has today. And he also oversaw Android's growth after Andy Rubin's departure [1]. While he may not have written code that's two world-leading consumer adoption stories. So many great engineers build products that never achieve great adoption. So aren't Pichai's accomplishments worthy of CEO-level…

> oversaw the growth of Chrome browser from minor player to the dominant position it has today. And he also oversaw Android's growth

Couple of personal observations-

Would it have been same if Chrome was not advertised on every google property and google intentionally breaking google properties on competitor browsers?

Also there was really no competition for android.

But not sure if the these two products were not world class then they would have worked.

Re: More Google Employees Are Losing Faith in Their CEO's Vision

#168
post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to work at another BigCorp (around $150,000/yr) and really thought Google pays competitively, but boy was I wrong. Here are two offers that I received recently: 1. Small company: around $160,000/yr + equity 2. Google: no exact number but I was told that for the level I was approved, the base is around $120,000/yr. Apparently my coding skills on a Google doc were equivalent to that of a new grad and they are re…

Is there a better way of making sure someone can actually code? It’s easy to take credit for past projects when it’s unclear how much help you had or what part you played. Isn’t the best way to judge a candidate asking them to create/produce something for you?

IMHO a better way would be:

- A non-trivial take-home exercise and give them a week or two to complete. This should have higher weight on the decision instead of the "Google doc coding" as most likely that's the type of code they'll be shipping to production.

- Use the onsite interviews to improve upon the exercise and/or to get into the nitty gritty details, and also to make sure this is the type of person people would enjoy working with.

- Allow candidates to run the code and to look things up (even Einstein didn't remember how to do long division, he looked it up).

- Give people the benefit of the doubt and assume they are not liars or thieves. If you end up having certain doubts, ask yourself why you have those doubts and take appropriate steps to remove doubts.

And let's be real. Do you think someone with X years of experience having worked at multiple companies (small and big corps) was hired because they couldn't code?

Re: More Google Employees Are Losing Faith in Their CEO's Vision

#169
post #63

Don't discount the massive increase in the number of employees. The more people you add, the more the culture dilutes. It becomes impossible for employees to feel like they're part of single a tribe with a clear goal. Factions develop, tensions mount, and you get angry employees leaking confidential information constantly. Most of the negative press the public has heard about Google in the past year is a direct resul…

I used to work a corporate job in an investment bank with around 30k employees. The majority of those employees were politicking chameleons with little productive output and a disproportionate salary. I used to hope that large innovative tech companies were different. From what I hear on HN it's becoming clear that that's not the case. It's almost as if the "largeness" of a company allows the non productive people to…

I always thought part of the point of how Google is structured was to prevent people from working for the competition. Why have 5 chat apps? Because 5 teams working on a chat app that will get cancelled in two years is better than all those people working on Ads for Facebook right now.

Probably not true but I did really wonder at times. Walking past people waiting in line for 30 minutes to get food when I would just grab a PB&J. Seeing people playing ping pong and video games, the same people every day, all day, as I walked between meetings. I eventually felt like I was Doing It Wrong.

Re: More Google Employees Are Losing Faith in Their CEO's Vision

#170

Once upon a time, Google used to be run by engineer types. When Larry and Sergey retired and handed the reins over to Sundar, a standard issue McKinsey drone whose technical contributions over the span of his entire career are close to nil, it was game over for the original Google culture. In fact, there is a theory floating around that he was chosen because someone very smart at Google predicted the huge oncoming co…

I upvoted this comment as there's a lot of truth to that, plus its the only comment with the obligatory word "thoughtful" on this thread, but to be fair, to find the person who introduced "McKinsey drones" to Google, look no further than Eric Schmidt himself, under whom they spread, and he attributes the McKinsey invasion to Shona Brown.

Arguably they may have been key to scaling the company. We never know what the company would have been otherwise as we can't rewind the tape and change history. Could have been a lot more visionary and inspiring. Could have also been much smaller and narrower without Eric and McKinsey functions.

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