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Trying to ‘Save’ the Rural Economy

nytimes.com

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Re: Trying to ‘Save’ the Rural Economy

#161

Post by jonathankoren »

weberc2 wrote: post #126
aurailious wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm pretty sure the comment didn't say that.

To be clear, I was responding to this: > Are you a blue-collar minority? Unless you know exactly when and where to go to get a license, then voting is practically impossible. How else can you interpret this? Blue-collar minorities are less capable of knowing where/when to get a license than blue-collar whites? Or perhaps the "minority" bit is a red-herring altogether and the salient criterion is "blue-collar"?

No. The discriminatory nature of laws like this work on statistics. While something like a drivers license with a street address isn’t discrimanatory per se, when you look at the groups that are adversely effected and how those groups correlate with voting preferences, a pattern emerges.

For instance, the lack of a street address in North Dakota pretty much only effects those living on an Indian reservation https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/native-americans-north-dakot...

Say you need a state issue I’d, but then limit access to those ids in specific areas, as Alabama did in 2015. http://www.al.com/opinion/index.ssf/2017/01/as_it_turns_out_...

In Texas, researchers ran an an analysis of where these laws have the most impact and found that the largest contributing factor to predicting disenfranchisement was race. https://www.wired.com/story/voter-id-law-algorithm/

Re: Trying to ‘Save’ the Rural Economy

#162

Post by dzdt »

Scoundreller wrote: post #116
pesmhey wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not everyone wants to be ‘richer’. That economists push that idea begs the question. I’m not placing a value judgement on either worldview, just pointing out that in one worldview, there’s an assumption of constant growth. I happen to fall into this worldview, but I’ve grown an appreciation for those who don’t. Unbridled growth = cancer.

> Not everyone wants to be ‘richer’. They say that, but if you write them a cheque, they'll cash it. It's the things that come along with wealth that they may disagree with, but certainly not the wealth itself. No doubt, there are pockets (even in Canada#) that refuse government welfare programs like health insurance because they feel that they shouldn't be dependent on others like that, but it's much less than 1%. #…

if you write them a cheque, they'll cash it.

Not 100% true. I grew up in farm country and there were lots of people (my parents included) who refused on principles to participate in federal CRP programs which would have essentially provided government checks for doing nothing.

Re: Trying to ‘Save’ the Rural Economy

#163

Post by snowwrestler »

weberc2 wrote: post #118
nimbius wrote: post #99

speaking as someone who works in a small town in the midwest as an auto mechanic, the people that shot themselves in the foot with this idea were the very ones who proposed it. I got 5 months of free online Python classes from the local government. This was part of some larger state plan to 'revitalize' us as a 'web 2.0' something or other for the 'silicon valley' of the midwest. The whole thing read like snake oil b…

What state is this? How do they require minorities to have ID but not whites? Apologies if these questions are naive, I'm not particularly familiar with midwest politics.

> How do they require minorities to have ID but not whites?

By only asking minorities to prove they are carrying ID. "The law" is what gets enforced, not what it says on the books.

Edit to add: as people are getting all up in arms about rural areas, they should recall that this tactic was broadly applied by the New York City police department too.

Re: Trying to ‘Save’ the Rural Economy

#164

Post by Scoundreller »

amyjess wrote: post #148
Scoundreller wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most of this land in the lower 48 was gone by 1900 or so and this is what people are referring to when they talk about the closing of the American frontier. Well, sorta. The feds still own 30-85% of each Western state: https://assets3.bigthink.com/system/tinymce_assets/944/origi...

Mostly because that land is so inhospitable that nobody wants it.

I’m really not familiar with the geography, or its history, but the feds only kept 2% of Texas. I’ll assume the rest became private.

Re: Trying to ‘Save’ the Rural Economy

#165

Post by [deleted] »

HarryHirsch wrote: post #134
dredmorbius wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look at University of Illinois Urbana Champaign. Supercomputing centre and home of Mozilla, but the talent and firms leave. And they don't head to Chicago either.

Why would that be? Midwestern smalltown politics and close-minded attitude? An Indian colleague who is teaching in the nowhere Midwest tells genuinely awful stories about racism and is getting ready to leave.

[deleted]

Re: Trying to ‘Save’ the Rural Economy

#166

Post by lotsofpulp »

HarryHirsch wrote: post #134
dredmorbius wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look at University of Illinois Urbana Champaign. Supercomputing centre and home of Mozilla, but the talent and firms leave. And they don't head to Chicago either.

Why would that be? Midwestern smalltown politics and close-minded attitude? An Indian colleague who is teaching in the nowhere Midwest tells genuinely awful stories about racism and is getting ready to leave.

Weather extremes, lack of mountains and beaches.

Re: Trying to ‘Save’ the Rural Economy

#167

Post by war1025 »

ourmandave wrote: post #144
nimbius wrote: post #99

speaking as someone who works in a small town in the midwest as an auto mechanic, the people that shot themselves in the foot with this idea were the very ones who proposed it. I got 5 months of free online Python classes from the local government. This was part of some larger state plan to 'revitalize' us as a 'web 2.0' something or other for the 'silicon valley' of the midwest. The whole thing read like snake oil b…

Need an abortion? book a flight, we require a trans-vaginal ultrasound and a waiting period. There's a coalition in my state that believes all life is sacred and abortion should be illegal even in cases of incest and rape. God's will and so forth...

It's a shame how much abortion gets pushed as a wedge issue. It's great at riling people up and getting them to cluster into their particular camps, but at that point people who would otherwise be able to agree on other issues and actually make progress decide to just not talk to each other.

Re: Trying to ‘Save’ the Rural Economy

#168

Post by war1025 »

pjc50 wrote: post #150
nimbius wrote: post #99

speaking as someone who works in a small town in the midwest as an auto mechanic, the people that shot themselves in the foot with this idea were the very ones who proposed it. I got 5 months of free online Python classes from the local government. This was part of some larger state plan to 'revitalize' us as a 'web 2.0' something or other for the 'silicon valley' of the midwest. The whole thing read like snake oil b…

It sounds like they're committed to the values that are important to them, regardless of the huge disadvantages. What's the way to change this?

That's true of most people. Emotions universally trump facts.

Re: Trying to ‘Save’ the Rural Economy

#169

Post by danans »

Glyptodon wrote: post #156
cgoecknerwald wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I absolutely agree with your call-out. If a company has to have a "good culture" to attract talent, then so does a county, city, or state. Since I no longer have to live in a state that fights against my rights, I may very well choose to live (and therefore work) in other states for the rest of my life. However, I do wonder if we are over-conflating "rural" with "conservative." Certainly, they are correlated, but I c…

The big differences between rural California and Rural Mississippi from my experience: 1. Rural California has way fewer black people. 2. Rural California is more geographically wealth-segregated. (The probability that a larger acreage and higher-owner-income rural property is adjacent to trailers is greater in Mississippi than California.) In rural Mississippi people pretend their black neighbors don't exist unless…

> 1. Rural California has way fewer black people.

But it has a large Latino population in an equivalent economic position.

Re: Trying to ‘Save’ the Rural Economy

#170

Post by jonathankoren »

dredmorbius wrote: post #95
chocolatebunny wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's weird that it kind of makes it a small town vs big city discussion. I think most of the big tech sectors seem to spawn near good universities. The universities supply the highly educated workforce for the businesses and the size of the city seems to play less of a role.

Look at University of Illinois Urbana Champaign. Supercomputing centre and home of Mozilla, but the talent and firms leave. And they don't head to Chicago either.

Andreesen left and went to Silicon Valley as fast as he could. While NCSA Mosaic was written in Urbana, he started Mosaic Communications (the original name of Netscape) in California, and was hated for years at UIUC after that.
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