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Tesla Faces U.S. Criminal Probe Over Musk Statements

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Re: Tesla Faces U.S. Criminal Probe Over Musk Statements

#161

I'm curious - supposing HN had the power to decide, would you replace Elon Musk as CEO of Tesla? What kind of future does the company have without its founder? Personally, I think I would be much more confident in Tesla, and much more likely to buy a Tesla product, if he were not in charge.

I would be far more optimistic if he was replaced with someone that has a good, established track record. Like, Alan Mulally. I'd go reserve a Model 3 today... :)

Re: Tesla Faces U.S. Criminal Probe Over Musk Statements

#162
post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, it can be an oversimplification, but in this case it isn't. He clearly wanted to pump up the stock price and screw short sellers (he threw lots of indicators in the public space), and his statement was clearly and knowingly false. There was no secured funding. Optimism might justify a statement like "final stages of signing funding" or "almost closed the deal" or even "funding as good as secured" -- there might…

> He clearly wanted to pump up the stock price and screw short sellers (he threw lots of indicators in the public space), and his statement was clearly and knowingly false. There was no secured funding. No this is not textbook at all. See previous citation from the SEC re: intentionality as a key element in criminal fraud. "Clearly and knowingly false" is just a serious-sounding way to say a misstatement. Did Musk no…

It might be gross incompetence rather than fraud you’re saying.

Re: Tesla Faces U.S. Criminal Probe Over Musk Statements

#163

Imagine a private company with ballistic missiles and submarines... I was musing the other day that Elon Musk may be planning to run for president. Why? Well, if there's one thing that 2016 showed us, it's that the road to the White House runs through snubbing Wall Street, calling the press a bunch of boring liars, accusing your opponents of pedophilia, making bizarre incoherent tweet storms in the middle of the nigh…

It'd be funny but since he was born in South Africa he's disqualified from running.

Obama was born in Kenya /s

Re: Tesla Faces U.S. Criminal Probe Over Musk Statements

#164
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As sad as this makes me (because I want Tesla to be wildly successful), I have to agree. This is textbook and brazen stock manipulation, a flat out crime.

I guess I'm a bit off-topic but sometimes I really fail to understand the USA culture. You can make the most outrageous and racist comments because of "freedom of expression" but making speculators lose their shit with a couple of tweets is a "textbook crime" for which you should "go to jail".

In this case it’s highly specific to the person doing the statement & the subject of the statement. And it’s not nearly as textbook as the comment implies. But the US has fairly consistent and specific case law on when speech is a crime precisely because freedom of expression was so central to the founding of the country.

Re: Tesla Faces U.S. Criminal Probe Over Musk Statements

#165
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As sad as this makes me (because I want Tesla to be wildly successful), I have to agree. This is textbook and brazen stock manipulation, a flat out crime.

I guess I'm a bit off-topic but sometimes I really fail to understand the USA culture. You can make the most outrageous and racist comments because of "freedom of expression" but making speculators lose their shit with a couple of tweets is a "textbook crime" for which you should "go to jail".

Yes costing people millions of dollars through securities fraud is a crime.

Re: Tesla Faces U.S. Criminal Probe Over Musk Statements

#166
post #155

I'm curious - supposing HN had the power to decide, would you replace Elon Musk as CEO of Tesla? What kind of future does the company have without its founder? Personally, I think I would be much more confident in Tesla, and much more likely to buy a Tesla product, if he were not in charge.

Do you want one of the most successful founders and tech CEO ever to continue to run the company? Äh, yes, Elon has made Tesla successful and he made it into a major car company that is still growth strongly.

How do you define "successful?"

If Elon is doing things that are illegal or otherwise just boneheaded now, how much leeway does he get? What would it take to make you decide he shouldn't be CEO?

Re: Tesla Faces U.S. Criminal Probe Over Musk Statements

#167

I'm curious - supposing HN had the power to decide, would you replace Elon Musk as CEO of Tesla? What kind of future does the company have without its founder? Personally, I think I would be much more confident in Tesla, and much more likely to buy a Tesla product, if he were not in charge.

I would sell Tesla to a large conglomerate that actually understands car production, like Toyota or VW.

Isn't there a good chance they'd just mothball the whole company and keep on making regular gasoline-engine cars?

Re: Tesla Faces U.S. Criminal Probe Over Musk Statements

#168
post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Shorts drive the price down, making it more expensive for the company to borrow from the market by selling stock. They have to sell more shares to receive a similar amount.

Shorts drive the price down Not on their own they don't. You can go and short Facebook right now and it won't move the price at all.

Sure it does short 20% of FB float it will sure move

Re: Tesla Faces U.S. Criminal Probe Over Musk Statements

#169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ted Cruz was born in Canada. The naturalization requirement is a lot looser than you might think.

He was born a US citizen though. The requirement isn't that you are born on US soil, but that you are born a US citizen. John McCain was born in Panama.

technically it says you must be a 'natural born' us citizen. who the hell knows what that means. If we assume the framers were well-read and fans of shakespeare, this means that anyone born by caesarean section is disqualified from holding the highest office. They were wise enough to know that the dermal microbiome of c-section children is destabilizing creates individuals of temperament ill-suited for the role.

Re: Tesla Faces U.S. Criminal Probe Over Musk Statements

#170

I'm curious - supposing HN had the power to decide, would you replace Elon Musk as CEO of Tesla? What kind of future does the company have without its founder? Personally, I think I would be much more confident in Tesla, and much more likely to buy a Tesla product, if he were not in charge.

I would sell Tesla to a large conglomerate that actually understands car production, like Toyota or VW.

Understanding car production is less important then for EV then massive battery investment and knowlage, building a integrated brand, global charging infrastructure and so on.

Toyota might be better at building profitable cars, but Tesla is better at building profitable EVs.

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