Why is it that nobody wants to fix the gender gap in nursing?
Greed, people want a piece of this boom.
The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science
161–170 of 684 posts
Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science
#162Earlier quoted context omitted.
This issue effects the entirety of technology sector which this forum represents a large group. Simply trying to deny the debate is not how you work things out. If anything that will just annoy the group more so.
I meant to respond to the response someone else made: It's not a debate to be won. Some people just keep insisting it is with this cloying, sweaty desperation. It's embarrassing, and it's awful that these Silicon Valley ghouls have so much power that we have to consider them at all. I read the article, it didn't have any real science and made a bunch of insane, half-baked assumptions. The guy is a dumbass and deserve…
In other words, you're the only sane one in this world full of crazy, stupid, sweaty, sexists, and you have every right to shut them up.
Sounds like a scary place to be, and I'm genuinely sorry you find yourself there.
Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science
#163As an additional perspective, here's an interview from James' perspective[1]. The interviewer is clearly fairly bias and holds the same viewpoint which is unfortunate but I think hearing James' perspective on the purpose of the document is interesting. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agU-mHFcXdw
This is an interesting video to listen to, but as you said, the interviewer is most definitely leaning a certain direction. That being said, I am not informed enough on the topic of gender differences to actually weigh in on who is right or wrong in this situation.
I am certainly not either, I just think people grabbed their pitchforks impulsively and painted him as a misogynist monster without hearing his side of the story. From the interview it sounds like the document was sparked from an internal diversity meeting that was dubious in its intent. Whether that is actually truth or not who knows but I get the impression James was trying to have a discussion and present some evidence but ended up getting roasted instead of having the discussion he was hoping for.
The issue aside, the hypocrisy in this whole situation is really what pisses me off. James appears to be soliciting discussion and trying to consider both point of views while the masses simply took whatever the media headline was an ran with it without considering both sides.
Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science
#164Earlier quoted context omitted.
Some people may have reacted that way. I think you're very intentionally trying mischaracterize people rolling their eyes the same way they always do as some sort of ignorant knee-jerk reaction. I read the memo entirely. It was half-baked, ideologically, but also creepy. I've heard what it had to say a million times before and it's still stupid.
> I think you're very intentionally trying mischaracterize people That's a pretty strong accusation. What is your evidence for that claim? Show me what I wrote that attempts to do that.
W.. what? Literally your post. I'd have to quote the whole thing. "many people's first instinct". It wasn't many people's first instinct.
Again, I read the article, many others read the article and wrote detailed responses. It's not my job to point these out. Someone making a stupid argument does not obligate anyone to engage or correct them. A massive popular backlash against a shitty idea isn't "trying to shut it down".
If I submitted an internal memo advocating pedophilia or something everyone would rightfully dismiss me. No one would be obligated to engage with my dumb ass, and you're all acting like that would be some kind of tragedy or moral failing on the part of everyone around me, rather than me for writing a stupid memo in the first place.
You should just say "I think women are inferior" rather than trying to dictate how people approach an incident adjacent to your agenda, just like white nationalists should just come out rather than being coy and hiding behind "free speech" issues.
Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science
#165Earlier quoted context omitted.
In modern days, suppressing free speech is 90% a leftist thing.
Didn't a republican congressman literally commit a violent assault on a reporter, and then win accolades by the right and get rewarded for it? Do you believe violent assaults chill free speech?
That would fall within the 10%.
Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science
#166Please don't flag the article if you simply disagree. The key to changing minds is understanding the other side. Not shutting them out of the conversation.
I flagged it. How many times do we need to have the same repetitive discussion? This topic is crowding out other quality submissions.
If people weren't interested in responding and discussing, the article would disappear on its own. The fact that people are paying attention means there is more to discuss. It's really not up to you to decide. Flag all you want but that's a terrible metric to use to make your decision.
Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science
#167Firing this guy was just a PR move in order to keep things under control. The memo was accurate and I know that Google is going to learn from it even if the guy has been sacrified.
Private companies are not free speech zones. Not firing this person would have been a Title VII violation and opened them to lawsuits.
Not firing this person would have been accused a Title VII violation and opened them to lawsuits.
Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science
#168Earlier quoted context omitted.
Some people may have reacted that way. I think you're very intentionally trying mischaracterize people rolling their eyes the same way they always do as some sort of ignorant knee-jerk reaction. I read the memo entirely. It was half-baked, ideologically, but also creepy. I've heard what it had to say a million times before and it's still stupid.
You're basically doing it yourself. Trying to dismiss it with adjectives as "half-baked" or "stupid". The point is, it's neither and I think it deserves a proper dismissal instead of ad-hominems and insults. Surely there is someone that can perform a point by point analysis and disprove the memo? I have not seen one comment doing that. Not one. So no, you don't get to say it's stupid and call it a day. Prove it.
I like this comment, though it seems a bit lacking in completeness - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14969178
Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science
#169Earlier quoted context omitted.
Consider the Medium piece she cites: https://medium.com/@yonatanzunger/so-about-this-googlers-man... Point #1: "I’m not going to spend any length of time on (1); if anyone wishes to provide details as to how nearly every statement about gender in that entire document is actively incorrect,¹ and flies directly in the face of all research done in the field for decades, they should go for it. But I am neither a biologis…
You haven't so much responded to my comment as used it as a coat rack to hang an unrelated argument on. I didn't cite Zunger's blog post and don't really understand why people like it so much. I'd prefer not to discuss it here, and thank you in advance for not demanding I do so.
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Re: The Google memo isn’t sexist or anti-diversity, it’s science
#170Not much new here. This article is essentially just re-affirming all the scientific statements that were already made in the original memo, backed by links to scientific studies. Only difference being that the author of this article has a PhD in sexual neuroscience (so people might have a harder time accusing her of not knowing what she's talking about) and is female (so some people might have a harder time of accusi…
> backed by links > PhD in sexual neuroscience > female There's a LOT that's new here, relative to Damore's memo.
Why does it matter what education a person has, besides as an ad-hominem attack, if the facts they use are correct?
And for the gender of the person advancing an argument to matter seems only to strongly confirm the memos points about discrimination against men.
Counter-factuals are always difficult, but it seems unlikely that we would ever have heard about this memo, much less seen its author fired, had the exact same text been written by a woman.