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Remove United from your flight results

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Re: Remove United from your flight results

#161

Post by mdorazio »

wklauss wrote: post #70
donald123 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And also, those $800, $1000 are just United voucher. The worst is they only issue 16 or 20 $50 vouchers, you can only use one voucher each time, and can only book through phone (which some people say is usually more expensive than online), oh and expire after a year. When more people know that, they are not stupid, it's useless even if they give you $10k. Basically they caused this no volunteer situation themselves.

You can use United vouchers online. I have volunteered a couple of times in the past and used them without any problem on United's website. You can also use them for multiple trips if the amount on the voucher is not exhausted. They do expire after a year, though, that is correct.

Did they change this recently? A few years ago when I was flying all the time, you had to use the vouchers at an actual ticket counter to redeem them. It was ridiculous.

Re: Remove United from your flight results

#162

Post by what_ever »

bingomad123 wrote: post #146
rm999 wrote: post #69

The comments in here are oddly fatalist about the whole thing. We put a lot of trust in airlines; and not just in safety or to get us somewhere, but we also give them an unusual number of legal protections once we're in their care. When the drama first started I kind of wrote it off: "this must have been a misunderstanding compounded by a single employee's stupidity". But when I found that it was not only condoned, b…

The worst part of the story was United's campain to smear the victim and to paint him as a sex offender.

Is there any proof that United was the one behind smear campaign?

Re: Remove United from your flight results

#163

Post by mc32 »

bigiain wrote: post #155
mc32 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think one is wont to hire these types[1] if one is not looking for a payout: "The 69-year-old medical professional has hired corporate law specialist Stephen Golan and personal injury specialist Thomas Demetrio". [1] http://perezhilton.com/2017-04-12-united-airlines-david-dao-...

Surely you're not suggesting he hired a personal injury specialist law firm _before_ he bought his ticket and got on that plane? Someone else _offered to get off this plane - for a few hundred or so bucks more than the on-site middle management was prepared to pay - so they chose to not only break his contract illegally, but physically assaulted him using hired goons to do so. I'd bet reasonable money that Stephen Go…

I think that's usually a reasonable presumption (that lawyers contacted him first) but it's not unquestionable if only because his past history with the legal system.

I would prefer restorative justice over punitive justice in this case. If people were not deplaned, another flight would have been delayed/cancelled affecting not one or two people but hundreds. There were jerks all around --from the people who physically took him out to the victim himself.

Re: Remove United from your flight results

#164

Post by what_ever »

donald123 wrote: post #23
sitepodmatt wrote: post #10

United screwed up by not having a decent incentive system in place to avoid deplaning people. People have presented many options, including taking a ballpark figure on checkin, or whilst on the airplance a speaker announcement anyone to travel later for $800, wait a minute, $1000, $1200, okay great thanks folks.. That was extremely badly handled and shocking that no process was in place for this - as last minute crew…

And also, those $800, $1000 are just United voucher. The worst is they only issue 16 or 20 $50 vouchers, you can only use one voucher each time, and can only book through phone (which some people say is usually more expensive than online), oh and expire after a year. When more people know that, they are not stupid, it's useless even if they give you $10k. Basically they caused this no volunteer situation themselves.

This is false. I have volunteered for flights on United in the past and I have a got a single voucher of the total amount ($800 and $500). Also I can use it online. I received them less than a year ago.

Re: Remove United from your flight results

#165

Post by PhasmaFelis »

macintux wrote: post #132
perseusprime11 wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is probably the reason United is going after the passenger's personal life. Their PR team is overworking on creating a different narrative instead of feeling remorseful.

Didn't news come out that the initial wave of personal muckraking was actually background information about a different doctor with a similar name?

That seems to be false, i.e. he is in fact who United claims he is--his hometown paper discusses it here. http://www.courier-journal.com/story/news/2017/04/12/yes-ken...

I can also confirm it personally because I have family in that area and it turns out they were treated by him. o_O He doesn't have the best reputation, apparently. Not that that's at all relevant to United's behavior, of course--it's like those cases where a cop shoots an unarmed man for no reason and they try to defend it because it turns out he'd robbed a liquor store the previous week. Was pretty surprising to me, though.

Re: Remove United from your flight results

#166

Post by killwhitey »

johnfn wrote: post #157
jedharris wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The well-informed discussion on Naked Capital ( http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2017/04/united-passenger-remo... ) strongly supports the claim that the removal was illegal. It also provides interesting evidence that the decisions were traceable to United's attempt to reduce costs by using third party contractors and affiliates (the flight was operated by Republic, an affiliate). This quote is telling: "When I was a ou…

I'm not arguing the fact that United did a really bad thing. I definitely agree with that. I'm only arguing the supposition that United is a uniquely bad company.

It's possible that this situation will cause all the other airlines to try improve their staff and bureaucracy out of fear of being next.

Re: Remove United from your flight results

#167

Post by [deleted] »

axoltl wrote: post #97
diminoten wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Read rule 25, and once you realize that employees are booked as passengers when moved like this, you realize there's a whole procedure in place for bumping people involuntarily from flights.

That's actually not true. From 14 CFR 250.1, definitions: "Confirmed reserved space means space on a specific date and on a specific flight and class of service of a carrier which has been requested by a passenger, including a passenger with a “zero fare ticket,”" "Zero fare ticket means a ticket acquired without a substantial monetary payment such as by using frequent flyer miles or vouchers" ... "A zero fare ticket…

[deleted]

Re: Remove United from your flight results

#168

Post by mythrwy »

foxylad wrote: post #61
sitepodmatt wrote: post #10

United screwed up by not having a decent incentive system in place to avoid deplaning people. People have presented many options, including taking a ballpark figure on checkin, or whilst on the airplance a speaker announcement anyone to travel later for $800, wait a minute, $1000, $1200, okay great thanks folks.. That was extremely badly handled and shocking that no process was in place for this - as last minute crew…

Would renting a private jet have been a viable solution for United to get their four employees where they needed to go? I have no idea what it costs, but given they were in the hole for several thousand dollars in refunds, it might have saved them money as well as grief.

Send the 4 employees in their United uniforms down to the Delta ticket counter?

Re: Remove United from your flight results

#169

Post by braveo »

singlow wrote: post #144
braveo wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the point that seems to get missed a lot. yes, the police did the brutalizing, but all of the decisions that lead to that confrontation were UA's. It's akin to arguing we shouldn't lock up people who pay for assassins, only the assassins themselves. And I'm not trying to compare an assassination to what UA did, only point out that the law doesn't give you a pass because you weren't the one who physically did…

But you can't be prosecuted because you called the police and the police beat someone up. Unless the police officer was conspiring with you to do something criminal, their illegal acts are not your responsibility. If I call the police because there is someone suspicious in my neighborhood and they show up and end up shooting an innocent person, I am not responsible for the shooting. The only exception I can imagine i…

> If I call the police because there is someone suspicious in my neighborhood and they show up and end up shooting an innocent person, I am not responsible for the shooting.

No, but this example illustrates perfectly what I'm talking about.

If the only reason you called is because it's a black kid, then people are going to be justifiably upset at you, even if the police are the ones who shot the kid.

What we're talking about here is why people are upset.

Re: Remove United from your flight results

#170

Post by braveo »

vinay427 wrote: post #140
braveo wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's involuntary if they don't let you on the place, but if you willingly walk off the plane it's voluntary. If what the person is saying is true, then technically speaking, the only one who could demand cash would be the doctor.

I disagree. United chose the other passengers who were to be removed as well, and so none of the chosen passengers volunteered to leave the flight as there was no alternative (default) option presented in which the passengers would remain on the flight. Threatening to call the authorities if someone doesn't leave doesn't qualify as eliciting a voluntary exit.

I'm not arguing for or against, I was explaining what the other poster meant since it seemed as if their meaning wasn't clear.

My statement about the doctor being the only one that could be compensated was definitely tongue in cheek.

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