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Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

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Re: Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

#161

Post by hacktothefuture »

mikeash wrote: post #118
timr wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, the reason GM "doesn't care" about the Volt (I'm exaggerating here; they obviously care a little bit ) is because they're rational: electric cars are not popular with mass-market consumers, and it's far from clear that they're going to become popular. GM is investing in what sells, and right now (i.e. for the last decade or two), that's SUVs and light trucks. Which doesn't bode well for Tesla, at least in t…

EVs are unpopular because cheap ones aren't very good yet. You have to choose between almost unusably short range, or a very high price. Something like the LEAF is affordable, but only useful as a city car. A Model S is a great car, but extremely expensive. The cost is coming down. Chevy is now selling the Bolt, which has pretty good range, for under $40,000. Tesla's Model 3 is coming soon. More will follow. The high…

100% agree but they have to be careful with the idea that "It's smart to invest in what sells right now... "!

The story is so reminiscent of Kodak. Huge 'titanic' of a ship that saw the writing on the wall, actually released digital cameras but the bulk of their infrastructure, employees and expenditures were in traditional film cameras. Once the industry fully shifted they still couldn't change course and died a slow agonizing death as taking pictures became a commodity that came 'free' with your cellphone.

Re: Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

#162

Post by erikpukinskis »

restalis wrote: post #17
marvin wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

31 million TSLA shares are currently held short, which represents somewhere in the region of 20% of the non-insider shares. (Yahoo finance says 38% of the float, so I guess it depends how many shares you consider freely available on the market). http://www.nasdaq.com/symbol/tsla/short-interest

Petrodollar players doubling-down?

There are some reasonable bets here. Russia has a vested interest in climate change... their biggest liability is cold and ice, a rise in sea level and 5 degree bump in average temps would give them a much bigger role in agriculture and shipping. Add that to the petrodollars from selling their oil reserves and you've got a game changer for them economically.

China probably loses at least temporarily in the runaway climate change event due to destroyed cropland and refugees. The U.S. has exposure on both sides so it's a little more moot for us. We'll lose quite a lot of biodiversity, and may take a big hit to agriculture but we're banking petrodollars and have so much upside when people move to virtual reality we'll be fine. If we were horribly exposed Dems/Reps wouldn't be split on the issue, as clueless as they are.

And of course there are the Saudis and corporate/investment petro interests you allude to.

Russia/Saud/Exxon vs China with U.S. on the sidelines... not sure who wins there.

I really hope we can transition to sustainable energy, but there are big players that stand to gain from delaying it until the reserves are burnt. It's not a bet I would take but I understand why people would bet on there being plenty of feet sticking out to trip up Tesla and co.

Re: Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

#163

Post by ithinkinstereo »

dmix wrote: post #120

Tesla recently announced they are ramping up their Model 3 production even more than what some people thought was already optimistic numbers: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-03-27/tesla-mod... > For Musk to hit all of his targets, Tesla would need to build about 430,000 Model 3s by the end of next year. That’s more than all of the electric cars sold planet-wide last year. > Even if half of the Model 3 in…

This reminds me when the iPhone came out. Tesla is making a revolutionary new product. Millennials are also coming of age now through the next decade. Many of these buyers, either purchasing first-time, or upgrading their "college/hand-me-down" car, will buy Tesla, just because it's fashionable (ala iPhone).

I'm bullish on Tesla and Musk.

Edit: I should add that the product extends past the car itself. The whole direct to consumer, transparent pricing, no haggling, will win over a new generation of buyers.

Re: Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

#164

Post by danhak »

prolly_a_moron wrote: post #160
danhak wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding. Your comments suggest to me that you think there was yet another secondary offering associated with this news. > The 8,167,544 shares of Issuer common stock were acquired by the reporting persons in a registered offering of common stock by the Issuer on March 17, 2017 and through open market purchases, for an aggregate purchase price of $1,777,842,836 (including commission). That means Ten…

> Tencent's position was acquired on the open market and the rest via the March 17 offering. Editing because I think we were talking past each other. Yes, I didn't mean this specific event. I tend to meld all these TSLA threads together in my mind.

Here's a comment you wrote elsewhere in this thread:

> It's my understanding that this was another offering, so, essentially, Tesla sold 5% to Tencent at an average price of $217 and change. Current shareholders get diluted. Prices go up.

This is entirely incorrect. The only shares Tesla told to Tencent were priced at $255 as part of the March 17 offering, and that only represents < 2% of Tencent's position.

Re: Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

#166

Post by prolly_a_moron »

hangonhn wrote: post #75
prolly_a_moron wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The raise will dilute earnings for common shareholders, so definitely a downward force on stock price. The stock is detached from reality. It's my understanding that this was another offering, so, essentially, Tesla sold 5% to Tencent at an average price of $217 and change. Current shareholders get diluted. Prices go up. I don't get it, but I'd love an explanation. Were people, prior to these capital raises, concer…

How is that really any different from any Silicon Valley company raising a new round of money? So long as the valuation goes up enough to compensate for the dilution, the per share stock price will be the same or higher. I'm not saying the valuation is correct but the fact that dilution happens and stock price goes up isn't that had to reconcile, right?

>So long as the valuation goes up enough to compensate for the dilution, the per share stock price will be the same or higher

But per stock price is the "valuation".

My comment re: being detached stems from the fact that on Day X, you can buy Tesla for price $Y. Then Tesla sells more shares (dilution). So now each individual share represents a smaller proportion of company ownership...yet the next day people are willing to pay more for that smaller ownership.

Obviously there are far more dynamics at play; but generally, dilution should cause the price to drop.

Re: Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

#167

Post by wfunction »

hueving wrote: post #147
aphextron wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> To sell that many $35,000 sedans in the U.S. “would be absolutely unprecedented based on what we know about car markets today and how people spend their dollars,” said Salim Morsy, electric car analyst at Bloomberg New Energy Finance. “It could happen. I’m pretty sure it won’t.” Model 3's will sell literally as fast as Tesla can push them off the production line. The pent up demand for this thing is insane. Over 40…

Or withdrawals from people. The deposits are non-committal so people can cancel without losing anything.

> Or withdrawals from people. The deposits are non-committal so people can cancel without losing anything.

I feel this is going to be the killer for them.

Re: Tencent buys 5% of Tesla

#169

Post by prolly_a_moron »

danhak wrote: post #164
prolly_a_moron wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Tencent's position was acquired on the open market and the rest via the March 17 offering. Editing because I think we were talking past each other. Yes, I didn't mean this specific event. I tend to meld all these TSLA threads together in my mind.

Here's a comment you wrote elsewhere in this thread: > It's my understanding that this was another offering, so, essentially, Tesla sold 5% to Tencent at an average price of $217 and change. Current shareholders get diluted. Prices go up. This is entirely incorrect. The only shares Tesla told to Tencent were priced at $255 as part of the March 17 offering, and that only represents < 2% of Tencent's position.

>This is entirely incorrect.

The comment was 4 hours old, based off a Seeking Alpha news bulletin (I should have known better) and was prefaced with "it's my understanding..." which left it open for you, or anyone else, to correct.

What exactly are you out to prove here?

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