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Sexism at Uber from Female Management

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161–170 of 234 posts

Re: Sexism at Uber from Female Management

#161

> In my time there, I saw malicious fights for power, interns repeatedly putting in over 100 hours a week but only getting paid for 40 Let's repeat one more time, don't do 100 hours week, you'll never get paid for it.

While I don't doubt the rest of the article, I will say as a former Uber intern (this past summer) the vast majority of us were not overworked. I (and most of my fellow Uber interns) worked between 40-50 hours a week, and we were paid hourly (with overtime being paid at 1.5x base pay).

Re: Sexism at Uber from Female Management

#162
post #129
post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Naw man, I'm not going to work there because I _need_ my bedazzled dungarees to code well." Please.

It wouldn't stop me from joining a company that's clearly better than the rest. But engineers have a lot of comparably good options in hub cities, so it's reasonable to be picky about small stuff - we can afford to be. A formal dress code does have real downsides: it (1) costs money, (2) wastes closet space (it's a premium in NYC!), and (3) makes biking to work or otherwise living a pre-/post-work active life more of…

The mistake you're making is that "work clothing" needs to be separate from your "after work clothing".

NYC there is no excuse for not finding good and reasonably priced tailors.

You might get dirty looks from those who look worse than you, but suits do in fact make the man.

Re: Sexism at Uber from Female Management

#163
post #131

Why do talented, or at least competent, software engineers stick around when they are treated like this? I left jobs for a lot less than what this person went through. I hope she gets a better job soon and I am glad all these stories are coming out now.

After a while, it beats you down, and you feel so bad that you can't leave. You kinda feel you aren't deserving of working in a respectful environment. This is aside from other things like not feeling like you can get another job, or having bills/bonuses that you'd have to repay, etc.

It can also feel normal. Based on what you've been exposed to you might not realize how bad it is or that you're not supposed to behave that way.

Young people who started careers at Uber may not even realize how odd this is compared to a normal or 'good' company.

Re: Sexism at Uber from Female Management

#164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not just high school, I'll use professional sports as a quick (but not all-inclusive) example. The Bill Belichick and Nick Saban enforce strict behavior and dress codes for their employees to simply eliminate distractions. Break the rules and they fire you. They're the most successful "mission oriented" teams of the past two decades. Uniforms contribute to the sense of "unity in direction" that the best companie…

So, distribute clothes to your employees. Bonus: You set the message by choosing to give tshirts, shirts or suits.

I'd certainly be happy to offer discounted tailoring / suiting and other clothing purchases.

"Look good, feel good, play good." -- Deion Sanders

Re: Sexism at Uber from Female Management

#165

> In my time there, I saw malicious fights for power, interns repeatedly putting in over 100 hours a week but only getting paid for 40 Let's repeat one more time, don't do 100 hours week, you'll never get paid for it.

While I don't doubt the rest of the article, I will say as a former Uber intern (this past summer) the vast majority of us were not overworked. I (and most of my fellow Uber interns) worked between 40-50 hours a week, and we were paid hourly (with overtime being paid at 1.5x base pay).

50 hours => 10 hours of overtime

Or 15 if you're in one of the lazy European countries, like France.

Re: Sexism at Uber from Female Management

#166
post #58
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>it seems clear to me this is not an example of sexism. >she was asked not to wear a tank-top to work She was not "asked not to wear a tank top to work". Her manager directly linked her (sane) clothing choices to the implication of promiscuity and its impact on her career, with an anecdote about one of her previous coworkers social habits and underwear. That's inexcusable. The employee's email is not "openly hostile…

I've re-read this, and re-reviewed the definition of sexism which is quite broad. I think the case could be made that the manager was actually displaying sexism towards Mark. How? By believing/saying that his decisions would be motivated by what kind of top the author was wearing. This is clearly an old stereotype of males and pretty much definition sexism. Her manager also comes of as an ass in this article; not sur…

That's a good point, that probably would qualify as sexism against Mark.

Re: Sexism at Uber from Female Management

#167
post #97
post #12

Perhaps I'm missing something, but I don't see anything that the manager is doing wrong. We can debate whether the manager is effective at her job, but it seems clear to me this is not an example of sexism. The only citation I can find relevant to the claim of sexism is that she was asked not to wear a tank-top to work. It may very well be that a tank-top is inappropriate attire at Uber's workplace. At IBM and many o…

> Perhaps I'm missing something, but I don't see anything that the manager is doing wrong. We can debate whether the manager is effective at her job, but it seems clear to me this is not an example of sexism. As a man, I have never had a single manager comment on the clothes I've chosen to wear at work... Or had my attire compared to a guy playing ping-pong in a speedo.

> As a man, I have never had a single manager comment on the clothes I've chosen to wear at work...

Happened to me a few times for various attires.

So far, it has an incredibly high correlation with bad management.

Re: Sexism at Uber from Female Management

#168
post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HR only exists to keep the company free from liability.

so this time they failed - is throwing mud on the Internet the only way of settling this? Or just most convenient and with best chance of payout? Something smells fishy here - many many people see the big pile of money at Uber and get some ideas

What money? They've got a -140% profit margin. Any money is already pre-committed to be paid out to the people using the system.

Re: Sexism at Uber from Female Management

#169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The manager wasn't telling male workers to wear long sleeved shirts, so that's the most obvious one. It was also obviously the last straw. Often in stories like these the last straw seems pretty stupid compared to a larger problem. People have a breaking point but it's often a small thing that puts them over it, the straw that broke the camels back. Although the story doesn't spell out the gender of everyone on the t…

I'm not following at all. Where does it say the manager "wasn't telling male workers to wear long sleeved shirts?" Even if so, how's that sexist? To say that something's sexist because a man gets different advice than a woman with no context is unacceptable criteria for sexism. Re: WFH, she's a junior employee (graduated in 2015) whose boss told her to "be at [her] desk to 'ensure that [she's] collaborating with the…

> Where does it say the manager "wasn't telling male workers to wear long sleeved shirts?" Even if so, how's that sexist? To say that something's sexist because a man gets different advice than a woman with no context is unacceptable criteria for sexism.

I'm saying she was told to wear a long sleeve shirt. I find it exceedingly unlikely a man was told the same thing and she didn't hear about it (especially as the male employees were joking about it with her, it seems likely they would have told her). Hence, only she was told that, which is a sex based (a protected class) restriction on clothing.

> She's complaining about getting reprimanded for "working from home for one hour in the morning."

Something everyone else on her team did that day. You are right we don't have enough context. But I'm saying it's (reasonably) possible. Suppose she was the only female on the team (likely) and there was a male coworker who was also a similarly experienced junior dev (possible). If she is told not to work from home, but he is allowed to, she is told to work at his desk, he can work anywhere, she is told to work on thanksgiving, he is not... that is straight up sexism. Even without those conditions the tone of the emails could have also implied it in each of those instances (to be clear those instances are all reported by her, but her coworkers actions and identities are not).

So yes, it could be just a bad manager. But it sounds like she told HR a lot of times she thought it was sexism with no response. Regardless of if it was or wasn't sexism, HR did nothing. That puts the blame on Uber, rather than just a shitty manager. And that means Uber can't say whether it was or wasn't sexism, because they didn't bother enough to care to investigate it. All of which speaks poorly of Uber.

Re: Sexism at Uber from Female Management

#170
post #81

None of what she described is sexism. Even the tank top thing, maybe barely. Her manager made a good point - maybe her career isn't progressing as fast, because she dresses very casually, and people don't take her as seriously. I don't think I've ever seen a girl in tech wear a tank top (not that I would mind, just pointing it out).

Yeah - males have to wear a coat and tie in order to be taken seriously in tech companies - why should it be different with women? Oh wait...

Are you saying it's not true for the males? In most big corporations you're required to ear a shirt and formal pants. Some require ties.
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