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Dropbox Paper

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161–170 of 214 posts

Re: Dropbox Paper

#161
post #35
post #30

Another closed file format. I think we're are in need of a lightweight document format, which is more complex than markdown, but needn't be as complex as docx. A quick google shows some results which look like pet projects of small business which have obviously failed (since I've never heard of them before) All of these new document formats that are pushed by big companies (some are really great I actually love using…

AFAIK it's all markdown and you can export your files as markdown. There's also an API available to export your paper docs as markdown.

Only export though? I can't just edit the files in place with emacs, which is my preferred way to edit anything? I don't mind if all the collaboration stuff was only visible with whatever dropbox editing UI, I'd just like the freedom to edit with whatever tool I wish to use.

Re: Dropbox Paper

#162
post #23

We used for a few rounds of design frontend review. It's actually quite slick. Seems like it's 90% there for a google docs replacement.

And Google Docs is X% there as a MS Office replacement.

Does Office have robust real-time simultaneous editing. I imagine Office 365 might have (does it?) - but how about desktop Office?

Genuine question. I'm asking about Word, Excel and Powerpoint.

Re: Dropbox Paper

#163
post #66
post #51

I'll throw Notion ( https://notion.so/ ) into the mix here, as an (as far as I can tell far more full-featured) alternative to this. I've used Paper a number of times, starting from long before Notion was a thing, having been a happy Etherpad and Hackpad user in the past. Somehow Paper managed to inspire less in my collaborators than either the latter services (where perhaps plain text was the factor) or than Notion…

Looking at the landing page, I have built some hypothetical mental model on how to use the app and its feature, but it's mostly guessing - it would be awesome if they put up a video showcasing real-world usage and features. "Task Board, Design Specs, Knowledge Base, Coding Docs, Team Handbook, Roadmap" - are these possible use-cases of the system? Or are they disparate document types? You create a document and pick o…

I'll try to give a bit of an overview to help answer the first three questions.

In Notion, all your documents are basically a big nested hierarchy of pages. Pages (generally) exist within another page, rather than simply being linked to (though you can link to pages in a different part of the hierarchy through either their URLs or by aliasing the page, letting a document live in more than one part of the tree at once). By nesting the pages, you get a nice table of contents in the sidebar.

Pages are composed of "blocks". These are just page elements, and most of these are the kinds of things you'd expect to see in a document (paragraphs, images, sections, bullet lists, etc.). There are some special ones, like TeX equations, inline discussion forums, and other things, but these are entirely optional.

Unlike a document in Word/Google Docs, blocks are more of a real entity that you'd interact with. For example, you can select a whole block (and any children) at once, drag-and-drop them elsewhere in the document (even to the left or right of other blocks, creating columns), link to them, and even transform them into other types of blocks (like bullet lists to numbered lists).

Pages themselves are actually a kind of block, which is neat. Let's say you have a giant page full of content, and you want to split out some of the sections in the page and put them in their own page. Simply click the block options for that section and choose "Turn Into -> Page", and now it's a new page linked where the section used to be, at the right place in the hierarchy.

Task Boards, Design Specs, etc. are really just templates. They're nothing special. You can make them by hand if you want to, or change them however you want. They're really just there to help you get going if you have use of them. No different than templates in Work, Excel, etc.

As far as WYSIWYG goes, since you're dealing with these page elements (bullet points, section headers, etc.), it really is pretty much WYSIWYG. You can select text or a header or whatever and change the styling a bit (colors, sizes, fonts, all to a limited degree).

Along with that, though, there's a form of Markdown processing. These are really more like keyboard shortcuts, though. Type "# " to get a section. Enclose something in backticks to make it appear as code. "* " for a bullet list. Things like that. It's not a full Markdown engine, though. There are a few bugs with some of these shortcuts, but they mostly work.

Editing in Notion is definitely a bit different, because you're kinda forced to think about blocks and hierarchy a bit more, but they've improved much of this over the past couple of months to make it more natural to work with. They've been hard at work with improvements, from the looks of it, so I'm expecting a lot of this to really improve more going forward.

Re: Dropbox Paper

#164
Regarding some of the sentiments in this thread... I have to agree...

How exactly does this help me/large teams?

Their customer list, sure, has "cool names" -- but the workflow support this provides seems to focus on 19 year old college grads who were forced to do group projects and have only ever touched a macbook air.

"beautiful interface" -- do you know how many pitches (including multiple companies from the decades past) attempted to sell their idea on "clean UI" failed and failed and failed?

Look if this works for you - then use it - but a white dude and an asian chick sitting in a clean room with a mac thinking about their "marketing" is pretty boring.

So - what does this do? How about show me the problem the two in the landing are working on...

---

"Before - we were trying to get the reqs from the PM to the devs based on the input from the marketing research of what our customers were asking for WRT features... the pipeline was clogged and nobody was on the same page... emails, PPTs, MTGs etc - nothing worked... then we brought in this new tool - spent a month and a half selling it to the devs to get them to actually create a fucking account, and 18 months later - we are 3% more effective than we were before!" YAY!

Sorry - thats how I see tools like such, "Lets disrupt 40 years of DNA on a particular workflow that our experienced devs have been using by showing them a lot of minimalistic whitespace and hi-res stock photos!"

how about turn this into a slack hook and let the devs do their thing and be up-front that this is for marketing and PMs and the devs should never see it. It should create requests of (producer of widget) via whatever method that (producer of widget) is used to....

or... found your freaking startup from day-one on a freaking tool...

Finally, it would seem that things like this are relegated to very small teams - and you should be wary of attempting to get other groups in your co to drink your cool UI kool-aid.

/cynicism...

Re: Dropbox Paper

#165

It's an operating theatre though. These and other features may require our systems to access, store and scan Your Stuff. You give us permission to do those things, and this permission extends to our affiliates and trusted third parties we work with. So, in order to work on collaborative documents, I give Dropbox, Dropbox affiliates and trusted third parties access? Who are these people? Others working for Dropbox. Dr…

> Export is .docx only and the export formatting is atrocious, non usable.

You can also export as MarkDown.

Re: Dropbox Paper

#166
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seriously. I landed on the page, watched the intro, and the little animated wizard created a rainbow. I actually sat there waiting for the damn wizard to deliver me an "aha" moment, but he just kept creating rainbows. Hah! I scrolled down and still don't get it. I actually like the wizard, but @#$%^... why can't landing pages actually explain to me what the @#%^&ing product is, or does.

> why can't landing pages actually explain to me what the @#%^&ing product is, or does. I like landing pages with lots of screenshots, showing how a problem is solved in a few steps. However, I tried to do that for my company and conversion rates dropped. So I had to give in to the marketing guy who was telling me to just focus on the benefits of using the product and not on how it solves it. Now our landing page has…

If you are not the customer for your product don't sell it the way you would like to be sold to. I fall into this trap all the time.

Re: Dropbox Paper

#167
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seriously. I landed on the page, watched the intro, and the little animated wizard created a rainbow. I actually sat there waiting for the damn wizard to deliver me an "aha" moment, but he just kept creating rainbows. Hah! I scrolled down and still don't get it. I actually like the wizard, but @#$%^... why can't landing pages actually explain to me what the @#%^&ing product is, or does.

> why can't landing pages actually explain to me what the @#%^&ing product is, or does. I like landing pages with lots of screenshots, showing how a problem is solved in a few steps. However, I tried to do that for my company and conversion rates dropped. So I had to give in to the marketing guy who was telling me to just focus on the benefits of using the product and not on how it solves it. Now our landing page has…

How savvy is your market?

screenshots mean nothing. Solve X with Y feature seems, to me, at least, to be best method to get people to convert.

Does anyone know the demographics of conversion-rates by age (within the same field) for their customers; I.E. if your a an [engineer] - how old are those that convert to [product] by [age]?

Re: Dropbox Paper

#168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, facebook is neither a face nor a book

Facebook was originally an online equivalent of a yearbook, where you know, there are lots of pictures of faces.

It was, more specifically, the online equivalent of a face book [0]. Which implies an answer to why name a product after printed media when it is not for print -- because it serves as an online equivalent or replacement.

[0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Face_book

Re: Dropbox Paper

#169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's Google docs but instead of being aimed at producing documents for prints, it is aimed at producing document for online consumption (multimedia) These documents can be used for notes about ideas, documentation, business plans, etc., etc. Kinda like webpages, but with an easy-to-write interface, collaborative chat, and easy user access management. Honestly, I thought the landing page showed that quite well. It did…

>It's Google docs but instead of being aimed at producing documents for prints, it is aimed at producing document for online consumption (multimedia) Pretty weird to name it after a printed medium if it is not primarily meant for printed media.

I think the point is that it's not a printed medium. You can do anything you want with paper... It doesn't give restrictions to what you want to do. You can doodle, make a mind map, sketch an amazingly detailed human eye, or actually take notes and brainstorm in your meeting. Paper is flexible. Software is not. They think they've made a good attempt with "Paper" at providing that flexibility online.

Also: https://youtu.be/j5dHMB1eCmY

Re: Dropbox Paper

#170
Just find it utterly surprising anyone is willing to invest time bringing Dropbox products (other than their core storage product) into their workflow considering their track record of killing off even popular products.
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