We're hearing about troubles at Nest • Hacker News Board

Re: We're hearing about troubles at Nest

#161

Post by st3v3r » Mon, Feb 15, 2016, 11:34 PM UTC

bravura wrote: post #150

outside1234 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The really great thing about being in software in Silicon Valley is that you can more or less write your own meal ticket somewhere else. My advice to anyone else in this situation is to do just that. The first time abuse happens, just walk out, have a laugh about it (it reflects on them not you), and find another gig. There are a lot of great jobs out there. I have a lot of empathy now for all the crummy jobs where p…

The first time abuse happens, just walk out, have a laugh about it (it reflects on them not you), and find another gig. With all due respect, why not look them directly in the eye and reply: "Don't speak to me that way" and wait? That sort of response helps other employees see how inappropriate it is.

Agreed. And if the next thing out of their mouth is anything but an apology, then walk out.

Re: We're hearing about troubles at Nest

#162

Post by st3v3r » Mon, Feb 15, 2016, 11:36 PM UTC

dwightgunning wrote: post #142

VikingCoder wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...which is why we should all be particularly angry when companies in Silicon Valley agree to not try to recruit each-other's employees. It doesn't just hold down wages, it makes it more likely some employee is going to suffer abuse because they don't know what options they have.

I thought the 'agreements' were related to active poaching. I wouldn't bat an eyelid hiring somebody who's already quit or is genuinely on the verge of doing so.

Nope. Someone at Google also was let go because they hired someone from Apple who came of their own volition.

Re: We're hearing about troubles at Nest

#163

Post by volker48 » Mon, Feb 15, 2016, 11:36 PM UTC

atonse wrote: post #8

I have a nest and it is a real piece of shit. I usually don't curse on HN but I can barely contain my hate for this product. My absolutely ugly, crappy old thermostat with a needle on it works WAY better than the nest (thankfully we have it upstairs where we sleep). When it's cold, we turn that needle up, and we get warm. With the nest, which is downstairs, when we're cold, we turn the nest up, we get weird "+2 hour"…

Polar opposite of my experience. My nest was easy to install and has worked perfectly ever since. It does do a +15 minutes if I adjust, but that is just telling me it will take that amount of time to change the temperature e.g. the temp is set to 65 but I change it to 70 and it will say +15 meaning it will take 15 minutes to get from 65 to 70.

Re: We're hearing about troubles at Nest

#164

Post by IgorPartola » Mon, Feb 15, 2016, 11:37 PM UTC

siquick wrote: post #74

IgorPartola wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A great way to fix that is to add more managers to gain better control of your runaway teams. Microsoft Project might be a good solution to get them back on track too. Planning out every hour of the project at the beginning really helps developers focus and get things done. Oh, and you want to introduce daily status meetings, preferably in the morning. As a final step, it helps to let a few people go and put a hiring…

I was crying inside until I saw the saracasm tag...

I was hoping for that reaction.

Re: We're hearing about troubles at Nest

#165

Post by st3v3r » Mon, Feb 15, 2016, 11:40 PM UTC

threeseed wrote: post #87

brandon272 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I still wake up with something like PTSD from getting yelled at and bullied by Tony Fadell. This is so depressing. My gut tells me that absolutely no one should have to put up with this in an employment situation, but what are your options, other than to either "deal with it" or face the income and career insecurity that comes with quitting?

There are no other good options. You can complain but you will get forced out eventually for rocking the boat plus it may affect your reputation in the market place. You just need to do what everyone does. Grit your teeth, stay positive and plan your exit strategy to another company.

Any company that would look down on you negatively for speaking out about this treatment is one that deserves to miss out on talented engineers.

Re: We're hearing about troubles at Nest

#166

Post by pound » Mon, Feb 15, 2016, 11:41 PM UTC

bravura wrote: post #150

outside1234 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The really great thing about being in software in Silicon Valley is that you can more or less write your own meal ticket somewhere else. My advice to anyone else in this situation is to do just that. The first time abuse happens, just walk out, have a laugh about it (it reflects on them not you), and find another gig. There are a lot of great jobs out there. I have a lot of empathy now for all the crummy jobs where p…

The first time abuse happens, just walk out, have a laugh about it (it reflects on them not you), and find another gig. With all due respect, why not look them directly in the eye and reply: "Don't speak to me that way" and wait? That sort of response helps other employees see how inappropriate it is.

and wait for what? performance-improvement plan as paper trail for firing? "company culture" term is exactly that: company-wide culture. it's not that there is one fucked-up individual and it just happened that his(her) bosses/peers are just not aware of what's going on. it's accepted there, for whatever their rotten reasons are

Re: We're hearing about troubles at Nest

#167

Post by st3v3r » Mon, Feb 15, 2016, 11:42 PM UTC

bobby_9x wrote: post #141

potatolicious wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "Being an asshole != "telling it like it is" though most people confuse the two." This reminds me of an old quote. "People who are brutally honest generally enjoy the brutality more than the honesty."

I've also seen honesty being confused with being an 'asshole'. You tell someone something they don't want to hear, but need to hear, and you are now known as an asshole.

Not usually. People who do that think they're saying something that someone needs to hear, but they're usually either wrong, or saying it in a manner that does make them an asshole.

Re: We're hearing about troubles at Nest

#168

Post by freyr » Mon, Feb 15, 2016, 11:50 PM UTC

brandon272 wrote: post #20

outside1234 wrote: post #11

I worked there. It was literally the worst experience of my career - and I have worked at all of the hardest charging blue chips and two successful startups - so it is not about high expectations - but abuse. I still wake up with something like PTSD occasionally from getting yelled at and bullied by Tony Fadell almost literally every day while I was there. I have a distance from it now -- and a way better job. It mad…

> I still wake up with something like PTSD from getting yelled at and bullied by Tony Fadell. This is so depressing. My gut tells me that absolutely no one should have to put up with this in an employment situation, but what are your options, other than to either "deal with it" or face the income and career insecurity that comes with quitting?

> face the income and career insecurity that comes with quitting

Get a firm job offer before you give your notice. You won't face any income uncertainty, and you'll have much more leverage while negotiating with potential new employers (unless let you it show that you're really desperate to leave your current gig).

Re: We're hearing about troubles at Nest

#169

Post by imron » Mon, Feb 15, 2016, 11:57 PM UTC

potatolicious wrote: post #114

xenadu02 wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd also point out that Jobs was know to have become less of an asshole by the time he returned to Apple. Some people think it was reconnecting to his family that helped but who knows. You can demand greatness without being an asshole. You can tell someone the work they did isn't good enough without being an asshole. You can also truthfully review someone's bad code without being an asshole, for what it's worth. Bein…

> "Being an asshole != "telling it like it is" though most people confuse the two." This reminds me of an old quote. "People who are brutally honest generally enjoy the brutality more than the honesty."

I heard it as: when you are brutally honest with someone, they will remember the brutality but not the honesty.

Re: We're hearing about troubles at Nest

#170

Post by code777777 » Tue, Feb 16, 2016, 12:02 AM UTC

asdfologist wrote: post #34

outside1234 wrote: post #11

I worked there. It was literally the worst experience of my career - and I have worked at all of the hardest charging blue chips and two successful startups - so it is not about high expectations - but abuse. I still wake up with something like PTSD occasionally from getting yelled at and bullied by Tony Fadell almost literally every day while I was there. I have a distance from it now -- and a way better job. It mad…

Honest question: how did someone with such an abusive management style lead his company to success? I'd think that his employees would just leave and go work elsewhere.

I never met the man, but wasn't Steve Jobs famous for this too?

I've read supposed accounts where he sounded worse than Nest's management.