Apple’s declining software quality • Hacker News Board

Re: Apple’s declining software quality

#161

Post by jakobegger » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 5:12 PM UTC

graeme wrote: post #99

The decline seems real to me. A shortlist of things I've noticed: * Spotlight no longer finds things as easily. I used to use it for everything. Since updating to El Capitan, it has missed some exact match folders. Planning to switch to Alfred. * iWork was gutted in '13. People used to use Pages professionally. I'm now using Pages '09, and planning to transition to Word or Latex. I tested Pages '13 intensively, and i…

Completely agree with the Wifi issues. My Macbook has become extremely unreliable, it often takes me five minutes connecting/disconnecting to get online.

Recently I've additionally seen random network slowdowns that are impossible to debug, and they happen only on a single Macbook -- all other machines on the same Wifi are fine. Completely unreliable.

Re: Apple’s declining software quality

#162

Post by joesmo » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 5:13 PM UTC

I'm glad someone wrote this extremely overdue article which would have, in general, been just as accurate two years ago as now. When Yosemite shipped with Safari that worked on only one of my three macs, I knew there was something seriously wrong. Constant bluetooth and RF wireless problems making peripherals hard or impossible to use. iTunes is so shitty, there is not a single redeeming thing about it. 4k support that works, but only sometimes and requires you to plug and replug your monitors till things line up magically. Shutdown/restart haven't worked properly for years and will frequently make the machine hang. Sometimes sleep does so as well, usually at the most inopportune times. The list could go on for quite some time.

Re: Apple’s declining software quality

#163

Post by lmm » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 5:13 PM UTC

Alupis wrote: post #125

pbreit wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Jobs didn't care about Xcode. iTunes was decent or even good. He hated social and reluctantly allowed Ping to go forward. iMovie is a tiny niche. I agree with OP. There is no way Steve would have allowed some of the current stuff to see the light of day.

> iTunes was decent or even good You clearly never used iTunes for Windows.

That may have been by design.

Re: Apple’s declining software quality

#164

Post by bedhead » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 5:15 PM UTC

iTunes somehow managed to go from one of the single-most enjoyable software experiences to literally unusable. Repeat: UNUSABLE. Bizarre to think that the application that played arguably the largest role in Apple's trajectory to hyper-success is now dysfunctional beyond words.

Re: Apple’s declining software quality

#165

Post by VonGuard » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 5:15 PM UTC

fuzzywalrus wrote: post #148

wwweston wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IIRC, Snow Leopard was actually the best release -- essentially Leopard but with a focus on stability and performance, plus the code signing stuff. It's the last OS X release that felt like an improvement to me, and one of the last OS X releases that I trusted. Every one since has actually had feature regressions (let's make a formerly visible folder invisible!) or stability issues. I still have a 2008 Macbook Pro ru…

Mavericks was tough to give up, stable, fast. No discoveryd. IMHO, its the best release of OS X. Maybe everyone has amnesia but pre 10.3, OS X wasn't really usable full time. Each 10.2.x release was a whirlwind of changes. Early iOS had wonky reset issues too.

Very true statements. However, those were growing pains. I feel like Apple's problem now is that it has completely given up on its overarching philosophy: to make software simple.

Instead, they're just offering us their own versions of things just because they can, not because their's is any better. Maps being exhibit A, and Apple's mail client not changing in 10 years (aside from some minor adds and removes) are examples of this.

Apple used to mean software for people who were not technology savvy. Now it means phone software for people who are not technologically savvy, and computer software that's just like everyone else's. Frankly, I can never figure things out on an iPhone. They're too confusing in their interface. Especially compared to my beloved Newton 2000.

Re: Apple’s declining software quality

#166

Post by walterbell » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 5:15 PM UTC

On the flagship iPad Pro with Logitech keyboard and IPSEC pre-shared-key VPN:

  iOS          Logitech      VPN
  
  9.1          OK            OK
  9.2          Fail [1]      OK
  9.3 Beta 2   OK            Fail [2]

Meanwhile, iOS 9.3 beta is slower than iOS 9.2, especially on older devices, http://www.cultofmac.com/406805/caveat-emptor-ios-9-3-beta-1...

[1] https://discussions.apple.com/thread/7372797?start=0

[2] https://forums.developer.apple.com/thread/30939

Re: Apple’s declining software quality

#167

Post by bb101 » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 5:15 PM UTC

graeme wrote: post #99

The decline seems real to me. A shortlist of things I've noticed: * Spotlight no longer finds things as easily. I used to use it for everything. Since updating to El Capitan, it has missed some exact match folders. Planning to switch to Alfred. * iWork was gutted in '13. People used to use Pages professionally. I'm now using Pages '09, and planning to transition to Word or Latex. I tested Pages '13 intensively, and i…

Glad someone else noticed that they hobbled Pages '13. You used to be able to link text boxes in Pages '09 and they removed that feature, and countless others in order to "align" the functionality with their inferior iOS product.

Pages is the only piece of software I have on my Mac where I need to keep the previous version safe because it was so much better!

Re: Apple’s declining software quality

#168

Post by thomble » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 5:16 PM UTC

graeme wrote: post #99

The decline seems real to me. A shortlist of things I've noticed: * Spotlight no longer finds things as easily. I used to use it for everything. Since updating to El Capitan, it has missed some exact match folders. Planning to switch to Alfred. * iWork was gutted in '13. People used to use Pages professionally. I'm now using Pages '09, and planning to transition to Word or Latex. I tested Pages '13 intensively, and i…

I too noticed the wifi issues when I got my new MBP with Mavericks. I had to stop/start the wireless service frequently. I eventually narrowed it down to some incompatibility between my Cisco Surfboard cable modem / WAP and the MBP. I reconfigured it as a bridge and connected a low-end Linksys WAP I had laying around. It solved the problem. I still think this is Apple's problem, since I'd used that WAP for years with many devices and never encountered an issue.

Re: Apple’s declining software quality

#169

Post by draw_down » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 5:16 PM UTC

I've used Apple computers since 2003, I think the decline is unquestionable. As many others note, more and more little bugs and problems seem to crop up than ever before. Everyone in here has an anecdote, so here's mine- on my work laptop, the hot corners just stop working for no discernible reason, and I have to kill the Dock process to get them back. Many small things like that.

And I don't even attempt to trust big things, like backing up my data with iCloud or using Apple music. Hell no.

It seems clear they've stretched their talent too thin over the years, and the yearly release cycle probably also has something to do with it. On the other hand, their hardware comes out roughly yearly and does not exhibit these kind of problems. Their hardware is still very good.

Re: Apple’s declining software quality

#170

Post by mattkevan » Thu, Feb 04, 2016, 5:17 PM UTC

There's a weird combination of things going on with these articles – a mix of:

1. Forgetting how truly crap things used to be

MacOS is better now than ever. Systems 7-9 fell over about every 10 minutes, 10.3 was the first version of OS X to be good enough for work and 10.5 'Leper'- nuff said.

2. Ostalgie [0]

Maybe Windows wasn't that bad after all...

3. 'Steve Jobs wouldn't have allowed it'

Good grief – Apple have had a long history of stinkers even when Jobs was around. Remember Ping, brushed metal UI, Apple Maps v1, Mobile Me, the iCloud launch...

4. Civilisation is crumbling

Things were always better than they are now. And the sky is always falling.

That's not to say there aren't problems, there are. Point them out for sure, but I don't think that these 'things are getting worse' conversations are very helpful. Just seems like negative opportunism.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ostalgie