Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO • Hacker News Board

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#151

Post by Jtsummers » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:30 PM UTC

iamthepieman wrote: post #19

Is there anything besides his donation to the Prop 8 effort that led to the controversy and him stepping down?

He supported an anti-gay marriage candidate with campaign contributions. Essentially, if he'd not had the Prop 8 donation, and only the campaign contributions, no one would have made a connection. His donations would've shown that he supported Republican candidates (since he, outside a response to the Prop 8 donation, made no statements regarding gay marriage that anyone ever linked to) and nothing else.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#152

Post by chrismonsanto » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:30 PM UTC

platz wrote: post #32

recusancy wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who is "this mob"?

Oh, just folks like Erin Kissane: http://incisive.nu/2014/thinking-about-mozilla/

> We can’t let that happen here: the open internet is not more important than gay rights or any number of other progressive causes, but it should and must be a broader movement. The moment we let “open internet” become synonymous with progressive causes—inside or outside Mozilla—its many conservative supporters will be forced into an impossible position.

This is such an important point. Please, let us not put all our eggs in one basket.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#153

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:30 PM UTC

nostrademons wrote: post #60

phillmv wrote: post #14

From the recode recap - http://recode.net/2014/04/03/mozilla-co-founder-brendan-eich... >“It’s clear that Brendan cannot lead Mozilla in this setting,” said Baker, who added that she would not and could not speak for Eich. “The ability to lead — particularly for the CEO — is fundamental to the role and that is not possible here.” The most damning aspect of this was their a) inability to predict this would be an issue…

It speaks a lot to his integrity that he didn't. Would you rather have a CEO who says one thing in public and then goes and does another thing surreptitiously, or one who stands up for his beliefs even when they're unpopular?

[deleted]

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#154

Post by eif034 » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:30 PM UTC

throwaway137 wrote: post #121

matthewmacleod wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

on the other hand we just showed that when a mob on the Internet wants something - they get it. I don't think that this follows. In this particular case, someone was promoted to a role which many felt was incompatible with his personal views; they made that known, and the person in question stepped down. That's kind of how things should work in a community enterprise. That said, I understand he's received wildly disp…

That said, I understand he's received wildly disproportionate abuse, like death threats. It must have been difficult for him to receive the same treatment as every sufficiently notable LGBT individual.

Burden of proof is on you to prove that "every sufficiently notable LGBT individual" has received "wildly disproportionate abuse, like death threats".

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#155

Post by chrisdevereux » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:30 PM UTC

_t5yy wrote: post #43

Beliavsky wrote: post #15

From the article: "We have employees with a wide diversity of views. Our culture of openness extends to encouraging staff and community to share their beliefs and opinions in public." Clearly people with socially conservative views are not welcome at Mozilla.

"any opinion is ok, as long as you're not conservative" I used to get this constantly in HS and now in college. This type of thinking is extremely toxic and I think can be very damaging for an institutions reputation. Mozilla is no longer about "openness" it's now about a much more generic liberal world view.

Any opinion is ok as long as you don't support slavery. There is always a range of opinions that people consider acceptable.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#156

Post by haberman » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:31 PM UTC

Really torn about this. On one hand it seemed pretty clear that Brendan was not letting these views carry over into his professional life. On the other hand, using his power (in this case, money) to actively stand against equality makes him, in my mind, an active and willing participant in the overall power structure that denies and marginalizes gay people. If I were gay I can imagine that being a bitter pill to swallow from someone who is the head of an organization that I worked for or supported. And likely not a great match for an organization that specifically prides itself on inclusiveness.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#157

Post by urschrei » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:31 PM UTC

platz wrote: post #32

recusancy wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who is "this mob"?

Oh, just folks like Erin Kissane: http://incisive.nu/2014/thinking-about-mozilla/

Erin's article is the least mob-like thing I can think of:

"I don’t see there’s much to gain by asking Brendan to resign."

And then: "Beyond that I guess I only have one more thing to say, which is to Brendan, who is doubtless also having one of the most challenging weeks of his professional life.

Brendan, I grew up in a very conservative religious home and many of the people I love the most can still be described as very religious and very conservative. I think your views on this issue are wrong, and that your actions have done harm, but I can no more caricature you as a terrible person driven by homophobia and hatred than I can break off relations with my cherished family members because they take actions similar to yours."

Why are you completely mischaracterising her post (and, by extension, her)?

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#158

Post by _t5yy » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:31 PM UTC

kylemaxwell wrote: post #91

_t5yy wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"any opinion is ok, as long as you're not conservative" I used to get this constantly in HS and now in college. This type of thinking is extremely toxic and I think can be very damaging for an institutions reputation. Mozilla is no longer about "openness" it's now about a much more generic liberal world view.

Bullshit. Any opinion is okay but if you are actively working to remove existing rights from other people, you can expect opprobrium. This applies especially when leading an organization with values like Mozilla's.

"Removing existing rights"? two years before that, this "right" never existed. For a right to be enshrined it has to survive, a majority of californians voted to approve prop 8...

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#159

Post by joe_the_user » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:31 PM UTC

Oculus wrote: post #6

I'm not sure how I feel about this one. On the one hand, Brendan Eich had some beliefs that were against Mozilla's core values, but on the other hand we just showed that when a mob on the Internet wants something - they get it. It's scary because this mob has global reach, unlimited power, but isn't always right.

I suspect that "being right", at least in the eyes of a lot of people not actively in the "mob" certainly made it much easier for this to happen and thus I don't see any clear "People from the Internet get what they want" precedent.

It's a large group lobbying a nonprofit to persuade it to have someone who represents the ideals they supposedly uphold. That Mozilla is a company that shouldn't stand for X political position is something lots of people agree with. That the CEO is the company face and can be held to a different standard than an ordinary employee is clear to a larger group than just activists for cause X (even if some large group on HN don't seem to grasp it).

For example, some movement to force the CEO of company X take a positive position in favor of political cause Y would have a lot harder time because it would seem much less reasonable to a larger group.

Re: Brendan Eich Steps Down as Mozilla CEO

#160

Post by izacus » Thu, Apr 03, 2014, 7:31 PM UTC

So what's the next step at Mozilla? Going through all department heads and eliminating those that are conservative cristians as well? Also those that don't agree with Obamacare?

Considering I've lived in a socialistic country where political party you belonged to was critical to attaining any leadership position... I'd really rather not return to that world. It was toxic, inefficient and downright unfair. Politics, religion and personal beliefs shoud NOT be a factor when choosing a person for position at a company.