Live data from Hacker News

The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

linkedin.com

151–160 of 165 posts

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#151
post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was concerned about this very thing when I was preparing to immigrate to Australia. In the end, because I had a job offer I got in on a 457 (good for 4 years) and didn't have to pay the ACS' accreditation fee. Even better, in 6 months when I apply for Permanent Residence I still don't have to pay the ACS because I've been working here for 2 years.

I am not sure this holds.

Luckily, it still does though the visa has changed from 1 July 2012. It's now a ENS 186. The relevant portions [1] are below. This visa costs 3060 AUD along with 540 AUD for the employer nomination, but that covers the entire family.

"Temporary Residence Transition stream

If you apply for the Temporary Residence Transition stream, your skills do not need to be assessed because you have already worked for your nominating employer for two years in Australia.

You must have at least vocational English.

This stream is available only to people who hold a subclass 457 visa. People who hold other 400 series visas may qualify to apply for a permanent residence visa through the Direct Entry stream."

[1] http://www.immi.gov.au/skills/skillselect/index/visas/subcla...

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#152
post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not sure this holds.

It does: I transitioned from 457 to permanent residence (ENS 856) without paying ACS a cent.

Congratulations! The ENS 856 has since been replaced, but luckily there is still the skills exemption for 457 workers.

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#153
post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That guy has - moved all over the world - applied for a visa while inside the country in question - some expectation that having an employer vouch for him means anything - most of his trouble with getting a COC out of Singapore Oz basically want to know you have skills, education and no criminal record. They ask you to go to some length to prove this. I really don't see a problem with this. As I say, they are in the…

That guy is me. My application for permanent residence in Singapore -- another place "swamped with applicants from all over the world" -- was all of three pages long but managed to cover skills, education and criminal records, was processed in a few weeks, and cost precisely $0. By comparison, my employer and I have paid approx. $10,000 to date to the Australian government in visa fees, not including the charges of t…

You, your employer and your agent are all having a harder time of it than me, an individual with no assistance at all, that managed to get through for about a third the cash and in far less time. I managed to navigate the system, why can't you?

Singapore is a business, not really a country, they want as many immigrants as possible. They have a stated aim to use immigration to massively increase the population. This is not the same situation as Australia at all.

And refugees don't have to apply for skilled visas, they come under other rules.

Good luck with your visa, but don't assume that everyone finds the system as hard as you seem to be.

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The main problems with working in IT in NZ are that there aren't many jobs, and the pay is much lower than in Australia. And since Kiwis and Aussies have reciprocal working rights, there are a whole lot of Kiwi IT people who've moved to Australia.

I've been told that NZ is seen as a backdoor into Australia. I don't know if that's a genuine phenomenon or whether it's just a third-hand mutation of some shock jock talking point.

It may have been. It's been locked down a fair bit since then.

It will get you here -- it wont get you PR/Citizenship/Centrelink anymore. ( http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&obj... )

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#155
Matt here. Turns out I've been talking to myself for the last year with a hellbanned account! lol.

The ACS just issued a media release: http://www.acs.org.au/news-and-media/news-and-media-releases...

Delimiter has posted an article as well: http://delimiter.com.au/2013/02/01/morons-freelancer-ceo-wan...

I find it humorous that the ACS's response is "the ACS Foundation has nothing do to with the ACS". It just happens to be an organisation they set up and uses their name that their members promote.

Some interesting emails came in overnight:

"The ACS is run by a whole bunch of accountants and lawyers who can't believe their luck that people associate them with the technology industry"

"You’re right that the ACS has to go.

Back in 2001 I contacted the ACS to discuss some policy things and was horrified to discover the “experts” I was talking to were nothing more than accountants. Later they elected a lawyer as president, and then a recruiter, prompting me to publicly condemn the ACS as a fake during the period 2004 – 2006.

The ACS is actually an anti-professional organisation. Their agenda is not to promote computer science or engineering expertise, but rather to allow pretenders to hide in the generic vagueness of “ICT Professional.” They actually work to devalue real expertise, since engineers and computer scientists pose a threat to accountants, MBAs and lawyers who want to claim membership of the technology professsions.

I think the solution has to be a formal inquiry into regulation of the IT professions, with a view to government stepping in and, as you put it, disbanding the ACS. At the moment, the ACS has insinuated itself too strongly into formal regulation. Simply starting a rival organisation for software engineers, say, would not work. Government has to dissolve existing ACS influence and leave the way open for new specialist organisations."

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#156
I've been working in Australian IT since the late 1970's and never once did anybody ask whether I had ACS membership.

When I graduated from uni, I looked at the ACS requirements and they were all to support the status quo of the 1960's EDP era. So I wouldn't have been accepted even if I tried. Even though I had the best computer engineering qualifications available at the time.

Over the years the ACS members I have had the misfortune of working with couldn't program their way out of a wet paper bag, not even using COBOL or RPG. Of course, as other comments here indicate, they abided by the Peter Principle and had been promoted to their level of utter dismal incompetence to muddle management.

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Compare that to a Canadian coming into the United States as a "Computer Systems Analyst" - Show up at the airport 20 minutes earlier than you normally would, give them a one-page letter describing your employer, what you'll be doing, where you'll be working. Include a either a 2 year diploma + 2 (3?) years of work experience or a 4 year degree. 10 minutes later you have a Visa good for three years. Normally one expec…

TN's all fun and games until you find an asshole immigration officer who decides you've been working for to long in the US. It happens.

I've been here since 1995, and have renewed 18 times, always at YVR. Approximately 20-30% of the time I run into a guy taking that position with me. (100% male TN inspectors over 17 years - that's some weird gender bias in a job which really doesn't have any particular need for men vs women) Sometimes, they go so far as to say, "I don't think there's anything temporary about your stay, you're planning on renewing again next year, right?" [note - I love how they try to close me on that. ]

Regardless of what they say, you always calmly reply with the following mantra, "My period of employment is for a period of up to 3 years [note: used to be one year]", at which point my plan is to return home to Canada.

Every statement you make with immigration must be some variant of that, and you must never, ever, suggest that there is the slightest thought/plan of staying past your limited visa, even if you plan to do that by re-applying.

With the exception of the first couple years (where I was rejected twice), I've never had to spend more than 10 minutes at immigration. I will admit the confrontational attitude does get your heart racing...

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#158
post #120
post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They used to have a "White Australia" policy until late 60s. (Basically yes, we want immigration in order to populate our country, but we only want white people). Since then they have stopped having racist immigration policies, so they have just reduced all immigration. It's all about keeping one type of immigrants out.

Yes, that policy from 50 years ago sure is good evidence that they have a racist immigration policy today!

And the American South having a policy of racial apartheid 50 years ago provides no context for the current day.

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, but to be fair, 22 million is nothing, especially for a country so big as Australia. Also, it wasn't just one crazy person or crazy group. They were random people in a bus, and they had the same anger and hate. Wtf was that? I'm curious, where in Australia do you live if I may ask?

Melbourne, same city as the bus attack. For what it's worth, that took place in Frankston, one of the city's dodgier suburbs, which has a reputation for crime, drug problems and lots of "bogans".

haha, Frankston... explains a lot.

Re: The Australian Computer Society should be disbanded

#160
post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is interesting to hear. I'm in the process of applying for an Australian visa (no CS degree). To get an independent visa, I need 2 more years of work experience, before I qualify to apply to have my skills tested by ACS in very specific (and almost esoteric) programming knowledge. And this is only the first step to apply for an 'invitation to apply' for a visa. What are my job prospects as a US software develope…

> What are my job prospects as a US software developer seeking to emigrate to Australia? Frankly, assuming you have the right to live in the US, you are much better off staying in the US if you want to maximize your opportunities as a software developer vs. moving to Australia. I say this as a Canadian who worked as a software developer in Southern California for 4.5 years but moved to Australia two years ago, largel…

Funnily enough realestate.com.au is one of the places running a Ruby on Rails dev shop, since I've seen them advertising for Ruby on Rails devs on lists that I'm on.
Post reply on HN