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Mark Zuckerberg attacks 'closed' AI rivals as Meta returns to open models

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Re: Mark Zuckerberg attacks 'closed' AI rivals as Meta returns to open models

#151

Post by timClicks »

kylecazar wrote: post #25
ViktorRay wrote: post #20

Comments here are surprising to me. I get folks don’t like Zuckerberg and his company and don’t trust his intentions… I don’t either. But this is an unquestionably good thing right?. The more open source software out there the better. And the more open weights or even over source AI stuff the better too right? More competition the better generally speaking I think. Unless I’m missing something and am getting this who…

Most probably believe this is a good thing, but don't want to give Zuckerberg credit because a) he's had a profoundly negative impact on society and b) the strategy is transparent, he's trying to commoditize his closed rivals, it's not out of principle. I personally think more open models are a good thing regardless of motive.

Facebook used the same strategy to compete with Google Maps. The company became one of the biggest contributors to OpenStreetMap, which everyone has benefited from downstream.

Re: Mark Zuckerberg attacks 'closed' AI rivals as Meta returns to open models

#152

Post by alex1138 »

kylecazar wrote: post #25
ViktorRay wrote: post #20

Comments here are surprising to me. I get folks don’t like Zuckerberg and his company and don’t trust his intentions… I don’t either. But this is an unquestionably good thing right?. The more open source software out there the better. And the more open weights or even over source AI stuff the better too right? More competition the better generally speaking I think. Unless I’m missing something and am getting this who…

Most probably believe this is a good thing, but don't want to give Zuckerberg credit because a) he's had a profoundly negative impact on society and b) the strategy is transparent, he's trying to commoditize his closed rivals, it's not out of principle. I personally think more open models are a good thing regardless of motive.

I can't get over his negative externalities

Just like closed AI vs open AI, his views on the covid situation might be fine in a bubble (though even with AI they have apparently lied about Llama's benchmarks) but it's one of these, "that's the hill you choose to die on?" - not Free Basics - not dubious privacy settings - not 'dumb fucks' and ConnectU - not... I don't know. It's like robbing a bank while telling anyone in earshot it's offensive how long the hold times are on the phone for the bank

He's seen with suspicion and rightly so

Edit: and the fact his site doesn't work. Posts don't work https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14147719 and messages don't work (forced encryption with Messenger, and, although this is an old link, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6090712)

Re: Mark Zuckerberg attacks 'closed' AI rivals as Meta returns to open models

#153

Post by overfeed »

drob518 wrote: post #51
forestrywat wrote: post #5

Is this "I'm losing so I think we should change the rules"? Because it seems like that.

It’s a long term pattern. When you’re winning (Anthropic), you keep the tech closed and try to monetize it as much as possible. When you’re losing (Meta), you open it up or drag it into a standards committee to either devalue it or slow the leader down while you prepare a “standard” version of it. You also highlight how altruistic and morally good you are for having done so. There is nothing new under the sun. It’s a…

> ...drag it into a standards committee to either devalue it or slow the leader down

Anthropic et al recently proposed a supranational AI governing body designed to slow everyone down (euphemistically calling it "AI pacing"). Are the Pacer signatories losing?

Re: Mark Zuckerberg attacks 'closed' AI rivals as Meta returns to open models

#154

Post by FireBeyond »

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #147
creaturemachine wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you read Sarah Wynn-Williams' book? The whole org is rotten.

Sarah Wynn-Williams book contains a number of implausible anecdotes which people repeat as gospel truth even though they have not AFAIK been corroborated. I am pretty skeptical, for example, that Sheryl Sandberg punished Ms. Wynn-Williams for not getting in bed with her.

And yet Sandberg has not sued for defamation…

Re: Mark Zuckerberg attacks 'closed' AI rivals as Meta returns to open models

#155

Post by juleiie »

That's the only thing he has left as the peleton is getting out of his reach day by day.

I honestly feel sad for him.

Remember the wind surfing photo? This guy is so weird probably since birth. Called a lizard person routinely. There is no cure possibly. Unless the AI can invent it.

Having money and financial success is one thing but the money simply can't buy you a normal human brain.

If you are a reptile once, you are a reptile forever.

Re: Mark Zuckerberg attacks 'closed' AI rivals as Meta returns to open models

#156

Post by skohan »

mcmcmc wrote: post #137
cataphract wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only the AI labs are really interested in closed models. Google, Facebook, Microsoft, ... they'd rather go back to doing stock buybacks and being ridiculously profitable rather than raising capital for all this research and datacenters. They only do it because they think they have to.

The alternative is ceding the leading edge to China and being dependent on them to continue releasing advances

Isn't this meta release kind of a counterexample to that?

Re: Mark Zuckerberg attacks 'closed' AI rivals as Meta returns to open models

#157

Post by laweijfmvo »

blueSky1989 wrote: post #67

My favorite paragraph from Zuckerberg's writeup: """ [...] it is surprising that the discourse from many developing AI is so filled with doom. I do not understand why anyone who believes that AI will eliminate most jobs and much of humanity's relevance would rush to build that future. The notion that AI is so dangerous that the only safe path is an extreme concentration of power seems inherently problematic. Historic…

i’ll take a stab: the enormously rich people rushing to build AI and replace everyone’s job will get richer, while everyone else suffers. that’s why.

Re: Mark Zuckerberg attacks 'closed' AI rivals as Meta returns to open models

#159

Post by imPndy »

I have to ask, is this "returns to open models" even correct, considering from a quick look the facebook huggingface collections[0] has been actively releasing different kind of models almost monthly for long time now, possibly even some actual open source ones (looks like Sam 3D had a dataset collection, but didnt look more into it).

Maybe they are not as noteworthy as the recent release, maybe they are too niche for general audience, but its not like they just stopped releasing open weight things and this is their big return, unless i am missing something?

[0]: https://huggingface.co/facebook/collections

Re: Mark Zuckerberg attacks 'closed' AI rivals as Meta returns to open models

#160

Post by subygan »

a2ff6eeb0 wrote: post #133
subygan wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

do you have a $100 mil worth of compute to train your own version of this? I don't understand what gripe people have with open weight models and wanting it to be purely open source. the training dataset is only going to be a copyrighted set of contents you don't want to touch with a 10 feet pole. let alone have a publicly traded company host it for you, even if they internally are training on it.

It's just about as open source as OSX, which can be downloaded zero cost here: http://updates-http.cdn-apple.com/2019/cert/061-39476-201910... I love that Apple made OSX open source.

we're calling it openweights now. what is a logical push to have a completely new paradigm be compared with traditional software binaries?
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