Earlier quoted context omitted.
I have done it before. How is it expensive, most brokers offer commission free trades now. It’s just another long order.
You have to pay money to buy those options
You can just have a limit order for the stock.
Short sellers notch $8.7B profit as SpaceX shares dip to IPO price
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Re: Short sellers notch $8.7B profit as SpaceX shares dip to IPO price
#152Earlier quoted context omitted.
> from every perspective but cooling, radiation shielding, and cost/ease of installation. Oh is that all? Those are major data center concerns. Don't forget the biggest one: an ocean-based system could be pulled up and serviced without the need for a human-rated rocket. Oh, and bandwidth/latency. The ONLY benefit of space is that it doesn't require siting a major construction in a town full of angry residents, and it…
Cooling is relatively easy, you just need radiators which are passive, and essentially reduce to a launch cost penalty. You are right that they can't be serviced, but that is missing the point of orbital data centers. The whole point is that you can build hundreds of thousands of these in a factory and launch them in a scalable manner. The power, cooling, etc. comes for "free". In the long run, as the cost of the chi…
The whole point is that you can build hundreds of thousands of these in a factory and launch them in a scalable manner. The power, cooling, etc. comes for "free". In the long run, as the cost of the chip, launches, etc. goes down, orbital data centers will scale better terrestrial ones.
How is this not true for terrestrial/ocean deployment as well? It will ALWAYS be easier to shed heat on Earth than it will be in orbit. Convection, conduction, radiation... in space, you only get the last one.
So take the same unattended hardware you were going to launch into orbit, and put it on a container ship instead. You'll be better off in every way. If it makes you feel better, lie and tell everyone that you launched it into space. Building orbit-capable data centers might make sense, but actually launching them never will.
Re: Short sellers notch $8.7B profit as SpaceX shares dip to IPO price
#153Earlier quoted context omitted.
You can always hedge your shorts and limit your downside. It’s not a huge issue unless you have absolutely no idea what you are doing.
Does market closing and not trading continuously affects this? If market opens at significantly different price, you may be forced to liquidate and loose more than expected.
Not if you use options. Let’s say you short a stock that is priced at $100 and you want to limit your upside risk. You can buy a call option that gives you the right but not the obligation to purchase a stock at a specific price.
One call option in the US equity market gives you the option to purchase 100 shares of the underlying stock at the strike price.
Let’s say you want to limit the downside (upside since we’re short) risk of your short position and you’ve sold 100 shares short at $100.
You can buy a call option with with a strike price of $110 that gives you the option to buy 100 shares of stock at $110 a share, which limits your upside risk to $1000 plus the cost of the option, which let’s say in this case it expires in 90 days and costs $300 or $3/share.
If 90 days pass and the stock a trading at $120/share, you will have an open short position showing a loss of $2000, but you can ‘exercise’ the call option to purchase 100 shares at $110/share which you return to the person you borrowed them from and closes out your short position with a $1000 loss, for a total loss of -$1300, including the $300 the option costs.
If it is trading at $80 a share after 90 days, you buy back the shares at $80 each and return them, closing out your short position with a $2000 gain, for a total gain of $1700 after subtracting the $300 cost of the option, which expires with a vale of $0 since the share price is under the strike price of the option.
You can hedge a long position with put options, it’s just the inverse of what I described. If you buy 100 shares of stock at $100/share while simultaneously buying a $100 strike put option, your downside risk is limited to the cost of the put option. If the put costs $500 (or $5/share) that is all you can ever lose as long as you exercise the put option to sell the stock for $100/share if the stock price is below $100 when the option expires.
Re: Short sellers notch $8.7B profit as SpaceX shares dip to IPO price
#154I completely understood the idea of Starlink and expected that it would be successful and useful, which it is. I've worked in data centers for decades now, and I am incredibly skeptical of the "data centers in space" sales pitch. It seems like an actual scam. Data centers submerged in the ocean or placed in the desert seem much more promising. But I have only an enthusiast's understanding of rockets and physics, so I…
For something to be a viable product it has to solve a problem. What problems are data centers in space solving? I can't think of a single one.
Re: Short sellers notch $8.7B profit as SpaceX shares dip to IPO price
#155Earlier quoted context omitted.
The physics problem regarding radiator arrays isn't unsolved, but it's not a problem that scales up gracefully. Small-scale radiators could get by via passive cooling, but large-scale radiators need active cooling, and now you need fluid, pipes, and pumps that all represent additional launch mass and points of failure (and the pumps are generating heat of their own, so now you need more radiators...).
Thermal dissipation scales quartically with T, that's about as graceful as you can get from a physics POV, very few things scale at that rate. COTs GPUs throttle at about 90-100C but that's because they have plastic parts and solder that melts. Those are relatively easy to eliminate. We haven't tried much to scale up operating temp.
Apple tried the damnedest at that during their intel era. Silicon gets exponentially leakier at higher temperatures, and that will outpace quadratic growth easily.
(Electronics that works at 200C do exist, but they're not gonna meet a modern smartphone's specs, let alone a datacenter)
Re: Short sellers notch $8.7B profit as SpaceX shares dip to IPO price
#156I completely understood the idea of Starlink and expected that it would be successful and useful, which it is. I've worked in data centers for decades now, and I am incredibly skeptical of the "data centers in space" sales pitch. It seems like an actual scam. Data centers submerged in the ocean or placed in the desert seem much more promising. But I have only an enthusiast's understanding of rockets and physics, so I…
For something to be a viable product it has to solve a problem. What problems are data centers in space solving? I can't think of a single one.
No noise pollution or actual pollution from gas turbines. No using water in the desert. No angry communities.
Re: Short sellers notch $8.7B profit as SpaceX shares dip to IPO price
#157Re: Short sellers notch $8.7B profit as SpaceX shares dip to IPO price
#158Earlier quoted context omitted.
The ocean is worse than space from every perspective but cooling, radiation shielding, and cost/ease of installation. But that just highlights how bad of an idea space-based data centers are at this time.
> from every perspective but cooling, radiation shielding, and cost/ease of installation. Oh is that all? Those are major data center concerns. Don't forget the biggest one: an ocean-based system could be pulled up and serviced without the need for a human-rated rocket. Oh, and bandwidth/latency. The ONLY benefit of space is that it doesn't require siting a major construction in a town full of angry residents, and it…
The ocean poses two major threats to any construction - water pressure and corrosion.
Re: Short sellers notch $8.7B profit as SpaceX shares dip to IPO price
#159Earlier quoted context omitted.
For something to be a viable product it has to solve a problem. What problems are data centers in space solving? I can't think of a single one.
No noise pollution or actual pollution from gas turbines. No using water in the desert. No angry communities.
None of these are problems if you put data centers far away from population. No one does that right now because it's a lot more expensive to set up and maintain, because you have to set up all the infrastructure from scratch. You know what's 10000x more expensive than that? Setting up the infrastructure in space.
Re: Short sellers notch $8.7B profit as SpaceX shares dip to IPO price
#160Earlier quoted context omitted.
No noise pollution or actual pollution from gas turbines. No using water in the desert. No angry communities.
None of these are problems if you put data centers far away from population. No one does that right now because it's a lot more expensive to set up and maintain, because you have to set up all the infrastructure from scratch. You know what's 10000x more expensive than that? Setting up the infrastructure in space.
Facebook put a data center up in Luleå, Sweden, which is in the north, far from cities, so it's not unheard of.