Something really scary is going on in Germany • Hacker News Board

Re: Something really scary is going on in Germany

#151

Post by thewileyone » Mon, Dec 10, 2012, 7:49 AM UTC

durbin wrote: post #29

Belgian papers sued Google a few years ago over similar uses of their content. It sort of backfired on them when google stopped crawling their pages. The internet and Google are more powerful than the German print media. http://blogs.wsj.com/tech-europe/2011/07/18/belgian-papers-a...

I wasn't aware of this story, but this is exactly what I would do if I was Google. Hey, you gotta protect yourself cause the next thing you know, the papers will sue for the search results.

I'd take evil to the next step, where I would now charge the papers for listing search results AND news articles.

Re: Something really scary is going on in Germany

#152

Post by bijant » Mon, Dec 10, 2012, 9:09 AM UTC

lenni wrote: post #42

FWIW, I've written to my member of parliament [0], expressed my dissatisfaction and asked him to oppose the law. He wrote back saying hat his parliamentary party is already opposing this law but for slightly different reasons: It won't increase the quality of journalism and will just create a flood of lawsuits. Lastly it is far too vaguely phrased as to not have grave side effects. The changes of the opposition are s…

fuck ströbele ! he voted in favor of the war in afghanistan and yet he still participates in all the peace rallies. He's just another lying corrupted politician

Re: Something really scary is going on in Germany

#153

Post by bijant » Mon, Dec 10, 2012, 9:21 AM UTC

schabernakk wrote: post #135

mtgx wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That does seem strange. Any idea what is happening to them? Are they going through leadership change inside the party or policy change, since that last scandal with one of their female leaders?

People closer to the pirate party might disagree, but from my outside perspective it has much to do with procedural problems the very nature of the party brings with them. They are primarily concerned with themselves. Lets take flat hierarchy goal for example: A good thing in theory which leads to a very tiring process when it comes to making decisions. On the last big conference for example there was a last minute p…

the pirate party certainly has some procedural problems. they would probably be the first to admit just that. But those problems stem from the fact, that they are trying to implement completly new procedures for political assemblies. procedures that take advantage of modern technology instead of just replicating an essentialy unchanged process from the 18th century. And if they should succeed, it could redefine democracy.

Re: Something really scary is going on in Germany

#154

Post by bijant » Mon, Dec 10, 2012, 9:43 AM UTC

what is really scary is not the proposed law but the public relation campaign google is mounting against it. It is a (very likely) unprecedented internet lobbying effort involving not only googles advertising network, but also a link on google.de (no longer visible). To a casual observer, watching the short youtube clip or reading the campaign slogan "Willst Du auch in Zukunft finden, was Du suchst?"("Do you want to continue to find what you're searching for ?") it could seem like the government was trying to shut down google search.

It seems like a scary prospect to think of the ways google, a private company, could start to use its unparralled reach to lobby for legislation in its favor around the entire globe.

Re: Something really scary is going on in Germany

#155

Post by Tichy » Mon, Dec 10, 2012, 9:53 PM UTC

daemin wrote: post #88

Tichy wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, and I would welcome that. But I think smaller publishers (including bloggers) might have problems, too. The law would apply to their blogs as well, they would have to figure out how to allow Google and others to still quote them. It might be so complicated that it would cause a lot of blogs to shut down. Other news processors were already mentioned in the article. I just fear that it would make it too costly to…

Blogs and smaller such institutions could license their headline and snipper 'content' for a nice fee of $0.

The question is, how do you license it? What if licensing it costs a government fee of 10000$ for the bureaucracy?

Re: Something really scary is going on in Germany

#156

Post by peterhost » Sat, Dec 15, 2012, 10:33 PM UTC

magicalist wrote: post #76

leoh wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"But the one thing I find really dangerous is that they (meaning major newspapers, politicians, etc.) managed to spin the story so that the narrative is now "greedy google" vs hard working journalists." Isn't there a certain degree of truth in this? Truly, there is a big problem if the rates for borrowing content is too high. But I think what the German public is responding to is how journalism has changed and not in…

the French courts were wrong several years ago when they allowed some newspapers to sue Google for simply posting a few sentences or a link to an article. But what if newspapers could charge a modest fee commensurate to the value an article link is to Google? I don't understand the distinction you are making between these two situations. Think about the larger precedent that you're setting here, however. Should I not…

Just for the record, French laws about "droits d'auteurs" and quotations allow you to quote any text under "droits d'auteur" as long as it remains a quotation (the definition of which is vague, and varies from one case of "jurisprudence" to another, but 300 words is generally considered reasonable)

This sortof is an essential preamble to free speech. Now, i agree with you, there's "quote" and there's "quote".