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Mercedes‑Benz starts large‑scale production of electric axial flux motor

media.mercedes-benz.com

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Re: Mercedes‑Benz starts large‑scale production of electric axial flux motor

#151

Post by cromka »

originalvichy wrote: post #97
miohtama wrote: post #87

Mercedes acquired Yasa (UK) couple of years ago and now getting up to the speed in the production. Here is a nice video that explains axial flux motors with a factory visit https://youtu.be/B2Hl4c1iZK0?si=VfDYARyuaPVj1nKm They are so, so, small.

I wonder how developing electric motors compares to combustion engines. My hunch says that it’s the main reason the Chinese high-tech electronics industry was able to develop and iterate leading electric vehicles so fast. (Edit: My more clarified point is regarding the machinery required + place to accommodate them to work on electric motors vs. ICE metal parts and all the intermediary parts transfering power in the…

AFAIK Chinese electric cars used western motor drivetrains and often still do?

Re: Mercedes‑Benz starts large‑scale production of electric axial flux motor

#152

Post by lucozade »

joe_mamba wrote: post #56
interloxia wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axial_flux_motor

Thanks for posting this. Axial flux motors aren't some new sci-fi invention. We've had them in gadgets for a long time like in the floppy drive example. This is just one of the first industrial scale implementations of high-torque applications.

> Axial flux motors aren't some new sci-fi invention

Indeed not. The first ever electric motor was an axial flux motor built by Michael Faraday in 1821. It's definitely not a new idea.

Re: Mercedes‑Benz starts large‑scale production of electric axial flux motor

#153

Post by pjc50 »

originalvichy wrote: post #97
miohtama wrote: post #87

Mercedes acquired Yasa (UK) couple of years ago and now getting up to the speed in the production. Here is a nice video that explains axial flux motors with a factory visit https://youtu.be/B2Hl4c1iZK0?si=VfDYARyuaPVj1nKm They are so, so, small.

I wonder how developing electric motors compares to combustion engines. My hunch says that it’s the main reason the Chinese high-tech electronics industry was able to develop and iterate leading electric vehicles so fast. (Edit: My more clarified point is regarding the machinery required + place to accommodate them to work on electric motors vs. ICE metal parts and all the intermediary parts transfering power in the…

The Chinese EV industry is actually lead by development of batteries, especially CATL. Along with the pack engineering, which is good old Mech.E stuff about heat transfer and physical strength.

Secondarily power electronics; at that scale, you can't just pick a bigger transistor and call it a day.

By comparison the motors seem to be a mostly solved problem, although I'm sure there's still some scope for power-to-weight engineering there, it's not as critical as the battery pack.

Re: Mercedes‑Benz starts large‑scale production of electric axial flux motor

#154

Post by sgc »

miohtama wrote: post #87

Mercedes acquired Yasa (UK) couple of years ago and now getting up to the speed in the production. Here is a nice video that explains axial flux motors with a factory visit https://youtu.be/B2Hl4c1iZK0?si=VfDYARyuaPVj1nKm They are so, so, small.

That was a good video, and I also liked the Munro video that does a nice job of explaining how these work: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m507ryWhc6c

Re: Mercedes‑Benz starts large‑scale production of electric axial flux motor

#155

Post by reactordev »

miohtama wrote: post #87

Mercedes acquired Yasa (UK) couple of years ago and now getting up to the speed in the production. Here is a nice video that explains axial flux motors with a factory visit https://youtu.be/B2Hl4c1iZK0?si=VfDYARyuaPVj1nKm They are so, so, small.

A few years ago I built a few small ones in my home lab. They are extremely efficient. With the right setup, have insane torque, and don’t require a lot of energy to do it. The best part for me was that they are completely brushless by design and are easily to keep clean.

Re: Mercedes‑Benz starts large‑scale production of electric axial flux motor

#156

Post by tw04 »

originalvichy wrote: post #97
miohtama wrote: post #87

Mercedes acquired Yasa (UK) couple of years ago and now getting up to the speed in the production. Here is a nice video that explains axial flux motors with a factory visit https://youtu.be/B2Hl4c1iZK0?si=VfDYARyuaPVj1nKm They are so, so, small.

I wonder how developing electric motors compares to combustion engines. My hunch says that it’s the main reason the Chinese high-tech electronics industry was able to develop and iterate leading electric vehicles so fast. (Edit: My more clarified point is regarding the machinery required + place to accommodate them to work on electric motors vs. ICE metal parts and all the intermediary parts transfering power in the…

>I wonder how developing electric motors compares to combustion engines. My hunch says that it’s the main reason the Chinese high-tech electronics industry was able to develop and iterate leading electric vehicles so fast.

The talent had very little impact to be honest. The primary factor was a government looking 50 years down the road seeing that:

1. ICE engines have little to no long-term future in transportation.

2. global warming is a thing whether the right wing in the US likes it or not.

3. They were never going to overtake the West in ICE engines and had to attack from a different angle.

The US' lack of breakthroughs in EVs has little to do with technology or expertise and everything to do with an administration that is openly hostile towards EVs and renewable energy in general. For the rest of the planet, EVs becoming the primary form of transportation is just an obvious and logical conclusion, even if it takes us another 25-50 years to get there.

China saw it and decided to heavily incentivize and subsidize the rapid expansion of EVs both to fix the air quality issues in China and corner the market.

Re: Mercedes‑Benz starts large‑scale production of electric axial flux motor

#158

Post by DonsDiscountGas »

deadeye wrote: post #90
DonsDiscountGas wrote: post #80

Only slightly related but does anyone know anything about motors with magnetic bearings? As in, no contact or friction. I'm looking for a hardware project

I wonder if that is even possible since the whole point of the motor is an imbalance of magnetic forces.

According to Claude it requires active control. So complicated and only used in very niche applications.

Re: Mercedes‑Benz starts large‑scale production of electric axial flux motor

#159

Post by pjc50 »

aitchnyu wrote: post #29

Tangential, how much regen can this system support? For example, can a car with 200kW propulsion have a 400kW regen (Tesla has upto 65) and are cost effective like friction brakes?

400kW regen is going to be a fairly alarming level of stopping for a normal vehicle. It's OK to leave emergencies to the friction brakes.

Re: Mercedes‑Benz starts large‑scale production of electric axial flux motor

#160

Post by DonsDiscountGas »

superxpro12 wrote: post #136
DonsDiscountGas wrote: post #80

Only slightly related but does anyone know anything about motors with magnetic bearings? As in, no contact or friction. I'm looking for a hardware project

I think air bearings exist? Maybe some prior art to consider

Oh yeah tons. I'm not looking to invent just tinker
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