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MacBook Neo Deep Dive: Benchmarks, Wafer Economics, and the 8GB Gamble

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Re: MacBook Neo Deep Dive: Benchmarks, Wafer Economics, and the 8GB Gamble

#151

Post by havaloc »

habosa wrote: post #131

Macbook Neo is amazing, so impressed what Apple can deliver for so little. That said, my sister this morning asked if she should buy a Macbook Neo. I pointed her to a refurb M2 Macbook Air with 16GB of RAM for the same price. I feel like that's the right call? Slower single-core performance but better multi-core and I think for 90% of normal people use cases the RAM is the limit before the CPU. Are others making the…

I think I would cut the line at M3 or above. I think M2 uses an older architecture and it doesn't have WiFi 6E in it, and of course single core is a bit lower. Also M2 batteries are about maybe halfway done already unless the refurb replaced the battery.

Re: MacBook Neo Deep Dive: Benchmarks, Wafer Economics, and the 8GB Gamble

#152

Post by kristianp »

I wish the author had toned down the chatgpt style of the writing. e.g. headers that say "What You’re Getting for $599". Another example: "Read those numbers again. The same chip that posts 3,569 single-core when cold delivers 476 after five minutes of sustained load. That is an 87% reduction in single-core performance on the same hardware, running the same benchmark, separated by nothing but heat."

Re: MacBook Neo Deep Dive: Benchmarks, Wafer Economics, and the 8GB Gamble

#153

Post by refactor_master »

wiseowise wrote: post #79
epistasis wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been on my M1 Air, 16GB, since a few weeks after launch, more than six years now. I still use it daily with lots of Docker containers, VS Code, tons of Electron apps, a small macOS arm VM, and lots of browser tabs simultaneously. Recently, Claude's VM environment is getting exercised simultaneously. Usually the memory pressure is into yellow, but responsiveness is still far higher than any Mac from the Intel day…

And you forgot the best part: it is completely silent.

Still baffles the mind that Apple solved this issue some 20+ years ago, and others _still_ haven't. I remember being basically surrounded by jet engines running Word in school.

A few years ago in an old job I got a monster-specced Dell laptop, and it would still roar if I opened anything. I had to pull all the nerf tricks through the BIOS to at least keep it somewhat tolerable in low-load scenarios (i.e. most of the workday).

Re: MacBook Neo Deep Dive: Benchmarks, Wafer Economics, and the 8GB Gamble

#154

Post by Rediscover »

locusofself wrote: post #129
rootnod3 wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same. Recently bought myself a M2 Air as a birthday gift for myself. 8GB, chucked OpenBSD on it and couldn't be happier. It does what I need, battery lasts long and easy to chuck around.

TIL you can run OpenBSD on apple silicon. With how much effort has gone into Asahi Linux, I'm surprised.

OpenBSD has had support for a bit over four years (v7.1, though the earlier v7.0 had /some/ support).

OpenBSD 7.1, 2022-04-21 -- https://www.openbsd.org/71.html

R/AsahiLinux posting from around that time, only one comment -- https://www.reddit.com/r/AsahiLinux/comments/u8rb2o/openbsd_...

Re: MacBook Neo Deep Dive: Benchmarks, Wafer Economics, and the 8GB Gamble

#155

Post by gumby271 »

Havoc wrote: post #117
afzalive wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> keyboard/shortcut situation is absolutely cursed. Not different...actually cursed You know, you can change almost any shortcut you want with Karabiner (app). You don't even need to memorize them. When I first switched to Mac after using Ubuntu for 4 years before that, I didn't expect this level of customization. It's misunderstood because Apple doesn't advertise this.

>You know, you can change almost any shortcut you want with Karabiner (app) That's actually my other complaint. "Fixing" problems with the OS with mystery apps. Connected an external mouse. Mouse wheel is inverted...weird? Google it. Yeah you can toggle it. Thank goodness. Apple knew people use mice. Oh but that inverts the trackpad too. WHAT? You're joking. I need to pick between a sane trackpad and sane mouse? I ow…

This one was shocking to me too. I get the argument around the upside down trackpad, but inverting the mouse wheel with no built in open is insane. I also have a mystery app who's only just is to correct this stupid behavior.

Re: MacBook Neo Deep Dive: Benchmarks, Wafer Economics, and the 8GB Gamble

#156

Post by omgwtfbyobbq »

havaloc wrote: post #151
habosa wrote: post #131

Macbook Neo is amazing, so impressed what Apple can deliver for so little. That said, my sister this morning asked if she should buy a Macbook Neo. I pointed her to a refurb M2 Macbook Air with 16GB of RAM for the same price. I feel like that's the right call? Slower single-core performance but better multi-core and I think for 90% of normal people use cases the RAM is the limit before the CPU. Are others making the…

I think I would cut the line at M3 or above. I think M2 uses an older architecture and it doesn't have WiFi 6E in it, and of course single core is a bit lower. Also M2 batteries are about maybe halfway done already unless the refurb replaced the battery.

It depends on the benchmark/workload. There isn't much of a difference per core between the M1 (3.7k) and A18 pro (4k) based on passmark, but I'm sure the A18 does much better in AI/similar stuff.

Re: MacBook Neo Deep Dive: Benchmarks, Wafer Economics, and the 8GB Gamble

#157

Post by mycall »

retired wrote: post #61
stirlo wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s a bizarre take. It’s not functionally useless, it supports a mouse, keyboard, printer or even an iPhone (non pro) perfectly fine at full speed. It also probably has enough speed for the average cheap terrible quality USB drive that the buyer of a $600 PC might have. This is a Silicon Valley tech geek take not a real world one.

The assortment of cheap USB sticks I have do not surpass 400mbit/sec. Not even the ones labeled USB3.0 or High Speed.

That is good enough speed for plenty of use cases.

Re: MacBook Neo Deep Dive: Benchmarks, Wafer Economics, and the 8GB Gamble

#158

Post by sixhobbits »

stirlo wrote: post #44
wlesieutre wrote: post #37

> The I/O is also a genuine limitation: one USB 2.0 port is functionally useless for data transfer, no Thunderbolt means no fast external storage, and charging occupies your only USB 3 port. You're supposed to use the USB-2 port for charging and save the USB-3 port for external accessories, not the other way around It only supports 10Gb/s compared to 40 that USB-4 is theoretically capable of, but that's more than eno…

It’s a bizarre take. It’s not functionally useless, it supports a mouse, keyboard, printer or even an iPhone (non pro) perfectly fine at full speed. It also probably has enough speed for the average cheap terrible quality USB drive that the buyer of a $600 PC might have. This is a Silicon Valley tech geek take not a real world one.

"genuinely" is an AI tell now as well as doing things in physical world that don't make sense like walking to the car wash to wash your car if it's close, or maybe not using USB ports in the way they were designed...

Re: MacBook Neo Deep Dive: Benchmarks, Wafer Economics, and the 8GB Gamble

#159

Post by QuercusMax »

retired wrote: post #58
washingupliquid wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

You get a message on screen that you should be using the other port. But yes, labeling should have been better. One of the USPs of MacBooks is that all USB ports are the same. Unlike other computers where you have to look where you are plugging it in. The Neo breaks that tradition.

That was definitely not the case on one of the macbooks I had, which wouldn't charge properly on the right side if recall. Maybe one of the last Intel macbook pros?

Re: MacBook Neo Deep Dive: Benchmarks, Wafer Economics, and the 8GB Gamble

#160

Post by adastra22 »

SecretDreams wrote: post #126
adastra22 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Idk, I think they are regretting the unit economics of the Neo, and it is likely cannibalizing the Air sales.

If they can use this product to lock more people into their ecosystem it'll work. As a lifelong windows/android user, I've been eyeing up the neo. Also, the Neo is just cheap enough that it's a product I'd consider buying that I don't need. I'm not in the market for a new laptop and certainly not an Air. So I'm a demographic considering this product that is not going to cannibalize their existing sales. There's gotta…

Do it. I've used Windows, Linux, and macOS over the years. Apple may be walled garden, but damn do they take care of their garden. It's worth trying out.
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