What about tourists and foreigners? Most smokers can't go more than a few hours without smoking... This will surely lead to a large black market.
Easy: anyone who cannot submit to the law of a country should not go there.
Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed
151–160 of 430 posts
Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed
#152People should have the right to make bad decisions, because with a population of millions of individuals you can not accurately decide what is a bad decision and what is just a less bad decision.
Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed
#153As a former smoker (who quit for seven years and regrets taking it up again), and as a present-day vape user, wtf. This is a clear restriction on liberty. It may be stupid that I do it. Just like many stupid decisions (junk food included), it ought to be my right to decide how to live. Cut off production so cigarettes are no longer made or imported. Don't block me from them while letting others have them. (Not in UK)…
In a country with a national health system, why should you be able to internalize the benefit of smoking whilst externalizing the cost?
You could use this logic to ban unhealthy foods, or restrict people from eating too much.
Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed
#154There are two separate issues here: 1. will this work (will the UK stop smoking) 2. is this something the UK government should be doing Setting aside 1 and looking at 2, it seems silly to me to point out that other things (alcohol) that cause problems and are not being restricted. You take the wins where you find them, and the government isn't a magical force that can impose its will on the people arbitrarily. This i…
From the government's perspective, this may (or may not) be silly. But putting that aside, if a citizen supports banning cigarettes for people born after a certain date, but not alcohol, that certainly seems hypocritical to me.
A minority of people who drink are addicted to alcohol.
Basically everyone who smokes/etc is addicted to nicotine.
They aren't the same at all.
Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed
#155As a former smoker (who quit for seven years and regrets taking it up again), and as a present-day vape user, wtf. This is a clear restriction on liberty. It may be stupid that I do it. Just like many stupid decisions (junk food included), it ought to be my right to decide how to live. Cut off production so cigarettes are no longer made or imported. Don't block me from them while letting others have them. (Not in UK)…
In a country with a national health system, why should you be able to internalize the benefit of smoking whilst externalizing the cost?
[deleted]
Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed
#156There are two separate issues here: 1. will this work (will the UK stop smoking) 2. is this something the UK government should be doing Setting aside 1 and looking at 2, it seems silly to me to point out that other things (alcohol) that cause problems and are not being restricted. You take the wins where you find them, and the government isn't a magical force that can impose its will on the people arbitrarily. This i…
> 1. will this work (will the UK stop smoking) What mechanisms do you foresee for it to fail? If stores stop selling cigarettes, the UK will have no other choice but to stop smoking them. I wonder what will come to replace them though. People have a peculiar tendency of forming addictive habits. Regarding question 2, personally, I am uncomfortable with the idea of a nanny state.
Right, because it totally worked with drugs. People just don't use them anymore. Weed is impossible to come by nowadays.
Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed
#157As a former smoker (who quit for seven years and regrets taking it up again), and as a present-day vape user, wtf. This is a clear restriction on liberty. It may be stupid that I do it. Just like many stupid decisions (junk food included), it ought to be my right to decide how to live. Cut off production so cigarettes are no longer made or imported. Don't block me from them while letting others have them. (Not in UK)…
In a country with a national health system, why should you be able to internalize the benefit of smoking whilst externalizing the cost?
pigouvian taxes are both a stronger disincentive and help cover externalized costs.
if this moves nicotine to the black market then the people/government will still pay the cost without receiving any taxes on it at all
Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed
#158There are two separate issues here: 1. will this work (will the UK stop smoking) 2. is this something the UK government should be doing Setting aside 1 and looking at 2, it seems silly to me to point out that other things (alcohol) that cause problems and are not being restricted. You take the wins where you find them, and the government isn't a magical force that can impose its will on the people arbitrarily. This i…
> 1. will this work (will the UK stop smoking) What mechanisms do you foresee for it to fail? If stores stop selling cigarettes, the UK will have no other choice but to stop smoking them. I wonder what will come to replace them though. People have a peculiar tendency of forming addictive habits. Regarding question 2, personally, I am uncomfortable with the idea of a nanny state.
Prohibition did fail and US had to revert ban on alcohol.
The rules are made by politicians.
All it takes to change the rules is to rotate politicians.
Or enough public dissent that the same politicians are forced to revert the rules.
Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed
#159Earlier quoted context omitted.
From the government's perspective, this may (or may not) be silly. But putting that aside, if a citizen supports banning cigarettes for people born after a certain date, but not alcohol, that certainly seems hypocritical to me.
Sure, maybe, arguably. Does it matter though? A world without smoking is still better than a world with smoking, right?
[dead]
Re: Smoking ban for people born after 2008 in the UK agreed
#160Hopefully vaping will still be legal? They do distinguish the difference between inhaling burnt matter vs inhaling a heated aerosol, yes? Of course not. The only thing government and private enterprise seems good at these days is taking things away from people. Logic be damned.
UK has public/socialized healthcare. If you are a smoker, you are much more likely to be a burden on this system. Makes sense to ban these types of activities if the costs of them are socialized rather than individualized.
I wonder what the cost/benefit analysis is for different addressable health outcomes. For example, under this justification could a government mandate a restricted calorie diet or enforce daily resistance training?