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Help Keep Thunderbird Alive

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Re: Help Keep Thunderbird Alive

#151

Post by skyyler »

encom wrote: post #137
monooso wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the avoidance of doubt, you won't donate to Thunderbird because you disagree with the following policy? > We do not discriminate on the basis of race [...], religion [...], gender, gender identity, gender expression, color, national origin, pregnancy, ancestry, domestic partner status, disability, sexual orientation, age, genetic predisposition, medical condition, marital status, citizenship status, military or v…

[flagged]

You say you don't care about these identities, yet you’re willing to let a tool you (presumably) value lose funding over a text block you find 'verbose.' It seems you care enough about the signposting to let it outweigh the software's actual utility.

Re: Help Keep Thunderbird Alive

#152

Post by RobotToaster »

cycomanic wrote: post #121
bachmeier wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been using Thunderbird for decades, I've donated in the past, and am likely to donate again. With that out of the way, the lack of transparency as to what happens to my money kills the incentive to donate. "How will my gift be used?" "Thunderbird is the leading open source email and productivity app that is free for business and personal use. Your gift helps ensure it stays that way, and supports ongoing develop…

I find that a weird sentiment. Why do people demand to know and control how every one of their donations goes, while nobody questions how corporations use their money. Ironically, the demand for this increased transparency significantly increases compliance cost, which means more and more money is driven away from the actual cause toward the administrative costs. Exactly what people don't want to support.

People are generally happier to donate money to a charity if they know it will go to a good cause, and not the CEO's seven million dollar salary.

It also isn't that unusual for donations to be ring fenced for certain things.

Re: Help Keep Thunderbird Alive

#153

Post by cbeach »

mrks_hy wrote: post #102
charcircuit wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gmail can be used from any modern platform through the web and has dedicated Android and iOS apps too.

It cannot do PGP, by design, just for a very obvious fault. It won't let you use your own domain and web storage. Sorry, no contest.

I use Gmail with my own domain (you have to pay for the privilege but Google Workspace has been very reliable and flexible for my purposes)

I'd rather use Google's web storage than my own. I don't have the time nor the expertise to implement multi-region replication etc.

I understand that granting Google access to one's emails might be a dealbreaker for journalists, dissidents etc, though - so clearly Gmail is no good if you have legitimate need for PGP.

Re: Help Keep Thunderbird Alive

#154

Post by glenstein »

zdc1 wrote: post #138
code-blooded wrote: post #11

Campaigns like this need more info. This page doesn't answer any basic questions. How much money do you currently get? How much money do you need and how will you use it? Does it even go directly to Thunderbird development or will be used up by Mozilla for other projects? Edit: I found some info here: https://www.thunderbird.net/en-US/donate/ Still, my point stands that communication around it should be super clear a…

Yeah, there's basically nothing explaining why the need more funding, and what they will do with it. Hosting? Salaries? Admin? You'd hope for a bit more context than this. > How will my gift be used? > Thunderbird is the leading open source email and productivity app that is free for business and personal use. Your gift helps ensure it stays that way, and supports ongoing development.

Mostly to "technical staff" who work on product and infrastructure. I just don't think the point of the donate page was to be an information warehouse but instead just a dead simple donate page. The other info is googleable if you're looking for it.

https://blog.thunderbird.net/2025/10/state-of-the-bird-2024-...

Re: Help Keep Thunderbird Alive

#155

Post by Ringz »

I tried for a long time to work with Thunderbird, but what kept bothering me was that I couldn’t simply define keyboard shortcuts. In the end, I landed on AERC and created my own extreme Vim-style keyboard configuration (the idea is to look at the list of mails like looking at a buffer in vim) for it. I’ve never been this fast when it comes to email.

https://aerc-mail.org/ https://github.com/rafo/aerc-vim

Re: Help Keep Thunderbird Alive

#156

Post by ubermonkey »

narag wrote: post #47

After reading a bunch of negative comments here, let me add a little on the bright side. I've been using Thunderbird for many years, currently both at home and at work to manage gmail accounts, pop at home, imap in the office. It works great for me, with a few annoyances but nothing serious. As for the donations, Thunderbird seems to be somehow apart from Mozilla now, so I don't think much about specific org structur…

I'm agog you're still using POP, honestly. ;)

Re: Help Keep Thunderbird Alive

#157

Post by smarnach »

latexr wrote: post #17

If you press the browser’s back button on the donation page, they send you to a page pestering you for your email address so they can send you a reminder to donate later. Talk about a dark pattern. Mozilla has really gone off the rails. An organisation who claims to work on behalf of the user and who makes a web browser, actively hijacking the user experience to peddle for a few dollars? Why the heck is Thunderbird “…

I wasn't able to reproduce the back button hijack. It never asks me for an email address, regardless of what I try.

Re: Help Keep Thunderbird Alive

#158

Post by swiftcoder »

glenstein wrote: post #129
swiftcoder wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> For what it's worth because legal names are confusingly similar, this is a legal subsidiary of Mozilla that is specific to Thunderbird Right, I get that, but why is it for-profit ? Fund raising is hard enough for nonprofits, convincing people to donate their hard-earned cash to a for-profit is on a whole different level.

My understanding is the for-profit structure was necessary in order to be able to do the search licensing deals finance Firefox.

That’s a separate for-profit. This one is narrowly scoped to operate thunderbird

Re: Help Keep Thunderbird Alive

#159

Post by glenstein »

rambambram wrote: post #37

Just donated. Have been using Thunderbird for years. I once donated to Wikipedia - and they have billions I heard - so might as well donate to another important piece of software for my digital life. Now that I read the comments I find out Mozilla might have enough money and a CEO taking in millions. Any recommendations for a good email client on Linux? Just as a backup for now...

>I once donated to Wikipedia - and they have billions I heard

I had no idea one way or the other, but if I'm reading this right [1] they are around $150MM currently for their endowment. Mozilla, meanwhile is actually around $1.2 billion and counting. But I think that makes sense for both, Wiki has the strongest donation drive in the world, and Mozilla is much more exposed to risk and in need of its firewall.

I don't think it changes anything, they're both good donation targets and Thunderbird is separately financed anyway so they still benefit from the $$ but I was surprised to see Wiki with the lower endowment.

1. https://foundation.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=File%3AFY...

Re: Help Keep Thunderbird Alive

#160

Post by debugnik »

glenstein wrote: post #129
swiftcoder wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> For what it's worth because legal names are confusingly similar, this is a legal subsidiary of Mozilla that is specific to Thunderbird Right, I get that, but why is it for-profit ? Fund raising is hard enough for nonprofits, convincing people to donate their hard-earned cash to a for-profit is on a whole different level.

My understanding is the for-profit structure was necessary in order to be able to do the search licensing deals finance Firefox.

No, MZLA is another subsidiary. You're talking about Mozilla Corporation.
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