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Colon cancer now leading cause of cancer deaths under 50 in US

theguardian.com

151–160 of 226 posts

Re: Colon cancer now leading cause of cancer deaths under 50 in US

#151

As a Multiple Sclerosis patient since I was a teenager, let me just say: all you “healthy diet” zealots aren’t helping. Your advice on which blended kale and gogi berry smoothie I should try is cringe and annoying. Normally, the person is right in front of me, and well-intentioned, so I typically smile and politely thank them with a non-committal gesture towards trying it someday. But since this is all one-party and…

You're on a discussion forum where the topic is colon cancer. Surely you understand that people are going to discuss it? It's a bit hard to tell from your post what you're saying. Certainly I can imagine being annoyed by constantly being given health advice from layman. But this is... a forum.

There's a bazillion ways to discuss a topic that don't involve giving advice with unearned confidence. Even just saying "My experience is that doing X helped" instead of "You should do X" is a massive massive difference.

Re: Colon cancer now leading cause of cancer deaths under 50 in US

#152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Guys, it's not the chemicals present in every packaged food you ever set your eyes on, or the pesticides every vegetable is grown in, it's just that you don't eat vegetables."

I can’t take hyperbolic appeals to the authority of chemical names = bad seriously. Let’s at least get specific and name a molecule with a known mechanism of action.

You don't have to take it seriously. If you think "mold inhibiting agent" on shredded cheese is good for you, keep eating it. It's probably been tested as safe and your body can't tell the difference.

Re: Colon cancer now leading cause of cancer deaths under 50 in US

#153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My comment is that it is not ONLY low fiber diets. There are a lot of other risk factors involved. Will high fiber help - absolutely. Is it the be all end all - no I doubt it. Western diet collapsed its fiber intake well over 80 years ago - it would have shown up already.

> My comment is that it is not ONLY low fiber diets. Well, you said "can't" and I asked "why", which feels very reasonable to me. Your argument seems to be that it wouldn't account properly for the data - specifically, you're saying we would have seen colon cancer rates rise earlier. > Western diet collapsed its fiber intake well over 80 years ago - it would have shown up already. I don't really buy this for a lot of…

Should be a betting service for this kind of thing instead of sports betting. Maybe all the men betting sports might read and change their habits based on the betting outcomes (and improve their health).

I would also bet top reason is fiber but it isn't the only reason - multiple factors at play.

Re: Colon cancer now leading cause of cancer deaths under 50 in US

#154
post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're on a discussion forum where the topic is colon cancer. Surely you understand that people are going to discuss it? It's a bit hard to tell from your post what you're saying. Certainly I can imagine being annoyed by constantly being given health advice from layman. But this is... a forum.

There's a bazillion ways to discuss a topic that don't involve giving advice with unearned confidence. Even just saying "My experience is that doing X helped" instead of "You should do X" is a massive massive difference.

That's fine. It's just unclear to me if the parent poster is being critical exclusively of people "irl" giving unsolicited advice or if they're speaking to the forum of users who come here explicitly to discuss topics like these.

If it's the former, I'm ambivalent. I don't give advice as a general rule. If it's the latter, I find that totally silly.

Re: Colon cancer now leading cause of cancer deaths under 50 in US

#155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My comment is that it is not ONLY low fiber diets. Well, you said "can't" and I asked "why", which feels very reasonable to me. Your argument seems to be that it wouldn't account properly for the data - specifically, you're saying we would have seen colon cancer rates rise earlier. > Western diet collapsed its fiber intake well over 80 years ago - it would have shown up already. I don't really buy this for a lot of…

Should be a betting service for this kind of thing instead of sports betting. Maybe all the men betting sports might read and change their habits based on the betting outcomes (and improve their health). I would also bet top reason is fiber but it isn't the only reason - multiple factors at play.

I think that's all very fair.

Re: Colon cancer now leading cause of cancer deaths under 50 in US

#157
post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After a ton of research, I think the generic suggestion 'Fiber' is not helpful. Some things to consider: >There are classifications of fiber, insoluable vs soluable >Even those classifications are overly generalized, and can/should be broken down into basically individual foods. >Fiber and the various types have impact on your gut bacteria. If your gut bacteria is bad, you might be fueling growth of bad bacteria. >Yo…

>I'm guessing the colon cancer thing is probably due to pollutants > You don't actually need fiber Hey, you know what fiber is good for? Speeding up gut motility! You know what a faster gut motility is good for! Getting toxins out of our body quicker!

In that case, wouldn't you want to include things like sorbitol?

I want to emphasize I'm not making any grand claims of advice. I'm more being skeptical of traditional advice as someone who had/has a colon issue and tried everything under the sun.

Re: Colon cancer now leading cause of cancer deaths under 50 in US

#158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After a ton of research, I think the generic suggestion 'Fiber' is not helpful. Some things to consider: >There are classifications of fiber, insoluable vs soluable >Even those classifications are overly generalized, and can/should be broken down into basically individual foods. >Fiber and the various types have impact on your gut bacteria. If your gut bacteria is bad, you might be fueling growth of bad bacteria. >Yo…

"Fiber from food" seems good enough. It's hard not to fibermax without incidentally improving your diet substantially. For example, beans are one of the best and easiest sources of it. Splitting hairs beyond that, like insoluble and soluble, is the kind of thing that just confuses and intimidates people about nutrition advice. It's a bridge you can cross once everyone is eating 50g+ of fiber per day, has chiseled phy…

This is hubris. I actually think I got my first colon issue because I ate too many beans.

Re: Colon cancer now leading cause of cancer deaths under 50 in US

#159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Fiber from food" seems good enough. It's hard not to fibermax without incidentally improving your diet substantially. For example, beans are one of the best and easiest sources of it. Splitting hairs beyond that, like insoluble and soluble, is the kind of thing that just confuses and intimidates people about nutrition advice. It's a bridge you can cross once everyone is eating 50g+ of fiber per day, has chiseled phy…

This is hubris. I actually think I got my first colon issue because I ate too many beans.

[dead]

Re: Colon cancer now leading cause of cancer deaths under 50 in US

#160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Guys, it's not the chemicals present in every packaged food you ever set your eyes on, or the pesticides every vegetable is grown in, it's just that you don't eat vegetables."

I can’t take hyperbolic appeals to the authority of chemical names = bad seriously. Let’s at least get specific and name a molecule with a known mechanism of action.

I think the people that dismiss this concern are just as bad and unscientific. It's a pretty decent Bayesian prior to assume that regular exposure to synthetic organic compounds in quantities or concentrations that hominids didn't receive exposure to in our evolution are likely to be potentially problematic. This is especially true when they don't occur naturally in any organisms biochemical processes and yet are active enough to interact with many of these things. This is OBVIOUSLY true for things used as pesticides / herbicides. We have evolved a natural aversion to areas where all the plants and animals are dead and rotting. There are good reasons for this to be a really good heuristic.

I'll go so far as to say that almost any pesticide or herbicide is likely to be bad for vertebrates and invertebrates alike. This is really likely the case for perservatives as well, for what should be obvious reasons.

It's really not that crazy to assume they're probably not good as a default assumption.

Go into a hardware store and almost every chemical, solvent, paint, etc. that you encounter is not good for you. Eat a salmon and enjoy billions of plastic particles. Open almost any prepackaged food and you'll be ingesting all manner of dyes, perservatives, anti-caking agents, etc. etc. etc. that simply weren't around in your food environment during our evolution. It's a surprisingly good baseline assumption that these things aren't likely to be good for you.

If you think about the study design and epidemiologic studies, it should be clear that it's going to be very difficult to prove harm in a lot of cases for things that are only a little harmful, or only harmful in combination, or harmful only after 20 years have passed since exposure, etc. ...except that the science is VERY clear: something (or lots of things) associated with "processed food" is really bad for you.

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