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A beginner's guide to split keyboards

justinmklam.com

151–160 of 260 posts

Re: A beginner's guide to split keyboards

#151

I am an owner of a Glove 80 and I cannot overstate how benefitial it was for me. It improved my typing speed and overall comfort. Also, it forced me to type correctly, using all my fingers and place them in the correct keys. To this day I think this is one of the best pieces of hardware that I bought.

Glove80 is super nice, though rather expensive.

I got one with low-force switches. It's very comfortable to type on, but between the low-force switches and slightly different layout from a regular keyboard (column-staggered, concave, symbols in different locations) I make more mistakes. So I usually type on my laptop instead, especially while coding.

Re: A beginner's guide to split keyboards

#152

No mention of the Kinesis Advantage 360? I was lucky and scored two of them for free, one from the ergo center at my employer, and one from a generous coworker who didn't vibe with his. There are a lot of keyboards I'd like to try, but I'm pretty happy with these.

Thanks for mentioning it, I included the Kinesis Freestyle (traditional split) but I think it's worth including the Advantage. Added!

Not to say you need every keyboard in the world in your article, but the Freestyle Pro is also nice - it's essentially a Freestyle 2 but with mechanical keys.

Re: A beginner's guide to split keyboards

#153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All typing guides I’ve seen recommend keeping fingers on home row. If you do that you end up pretty close to what that drawing shows. Homerow centric posture is imho the main cause of keyboard related pain.

> All typing guides I’ve seen recommend keeping fingers on home row. If you do that you end up pretty close to what that drawing shows. I type at 130 - 135 wpm with my fingers on the home row. I don't have a posture anything like that drawing. In fact I have to make a conscious and uncomfortable effort to contort my hands into that position. It's far more natural (for me) to curve my fingers to hit the right keys rat…

The base idea behind keeping your fingers on the home row makes sense, as it promises that you can reach most of the commonly used keys by just curling or straightening your fingers, without moving your wrists at all. This doesn’t appear true in your picture. How does the person reach T with a finger that’s already straight, while still keeping a finger on A?

This is obviously not an exact science and I’m sure you manage to type just fine. However, if given a choice of regular and split, I don’t see how one could argue that they’re just the same. For me personally, I used to type with a lot of wrist movement and had trouble learning true touch typing for decades, but learned it on a split in a few weeks.

Re: A beginner's guide to split keyboards

#154

I'm mildly interested in keyboard ergonomics and efficiency, but every time I read threads like this I can't really see me spending $200+ on a keyboard when there are quite functional versions at $10 (and I know that the vast majority of the world is typing on either those or a laptop keyboard). To me it reads too much like an audiophile discussion about whether the materials of the cable affect sound, or just people…

There are much cheaper Microsoft ergonomic keyboards, even if the 2 keyboard halves are not separate, so you cannot adjust the distance between them or the lateral tilting.

I had been using for many years Microsoft ergonomic keyboards and it was still much more comfortable than with a classic keyboard.

A few years ago I have switched to a really split keyboard (Kinesis Freestyle), which was an improvement over Microsoft, but not a so great improvement as Microsoft was over a standard keyboard.

Unfortunately, Microsoft has first discontinued their cheapest ergonomic keyboards, which had almost the same price as standard keyboards. Then the remaining more expensive models have been sold to Incase in 2024, so they can now be found "Incase Designed by Microsoft" products, but at significantly higher prices than when they were made by Microsoft. Even so, they might be the cheapest ergonomic keyboards of decent quality. Microsoft still sells a "Microsoft Surface Ergonomic Keyboard".

Old stock cheaper Microsoft ergonomic keyboards may still be found at certain shops.

On eBay and the like a lot of old and very cheap Microsoft ergonomic keyboards can be found, but buying a "pre-owned" keyboard is risky, as you do not know how worn out it is. Moreover the wireless MS keyboards used proprietary USB dongles paired with the keyboard. If an old wireless keyboard is sold without the dongle, it cannot be used unless it also has a wired connection.

For someone who types all day, there is a great difference in comfort and fatigue between a classic keyboard and a good ergonomic keyboard. Young people typically do not care much about the quality of their keyboards, pointing devices and monitors, but after decades of using computers every day many of them regret their negligence, which could have avoided unpleasant health problems.

Re: A beginner's guide to split keyboards

#155

I'm mildly interested in keyboard ergonomics and efficiency, but every time I read threads like this I can't really see me spending $200+ on a keyboard when there are quite functional versions at $10 (and I know that the vast majority of the world is typing on either those or a laptop keyboard). To me it reads too much like an audiophile discussion about whether the materials of the cable affect sound, or just people…

It's very much a hobby, like audiophiles, but also like tricking out your car. It can be expensive. It's more than the average person needs. It's fun picking out parts and being part of a community. There's also a perspective bias that most mechanical keyboard content you see is not made by people who found a keyboard that made the wrists stop hurting and then went on with their life. The people enthusiastic enough t…

I think this is exactly it. I started getting RSI, spent a little time researching, bought a zsa moonlander and it cured me.

I haven't turned it into a hobby, it's just a tool that solves a problem.

Re: A beginner's guide to split keyboards

#156
post #33

I resent the idea of an absolute standard of ergonomics or typing technique. I often use my left thumb to key z/x/c/v/b. I often reach with my left index finger to key y/h/b. During certain chords, my hands often cross over the split. I tried multiple split keyboards over the period of 2 years and never grew out of these habits. I always wished, at the least, that some of the middle keys were duplicated between the t…

> Then the chronic wrist pain that led me to try split keyboards in the first place vanished. The elephant in the room with the 'ergonomics' argument for split keyboards is that you get a marginal improvement using the keyboard this way and ten times the effect by just getting up and going for a five minute walk every hour or so. The same goes for mousephobia, which overlaps with split layout users. I still use neovi…

There’s no reason not to try things. I’ve experienced CTS symptoms when using a regular mouse, which got fully resolved for years now by switching to a vertical one. Regardless of whether I should also make lifestyle changes, there’s zero reason to go back to an inferior mouse, just because that’s the design someone came up with in the 1960s.

Re: A beginner's guide to split keyboards

#157

My two cents: The Keychron Q11 is a decent choice for a split keyboard which also has a traditional layout and therefore doesn't require any learning. If you don't like the distance, you _can_ push the pieces back together and they'll just resemble a traditional keyboard. And it's definitely the highest build quality of any keyboard I've used this far in my life. It seems to have this issue (or maybe Macbooks do? I d…

I have the Q11 too (and I fully agree with your appreciation of it), but I'd like to say that I never had this issue with the keyboard. I _do_ have it connected to the laptop (tested both on a M2 macbook air and a M4 Pro macbook pro) through a `ThinkPad Thunderbolt 3 Dock Gen 2` -- not sure if that may be what's avoiding your problem.

Re: A beginner's guide to split keyboards

#158
post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> All typing guides I’ve seen recommend keeping fingers on home row. If you do that you end up pretty close to what that drawing shows. I type at 130 - 135 wpm with my fingers on the home row. I don't have a posture anything like that drawing. In fact I have to make a conscious and uncomfortable effort to contort my hands into that position. It's far more natural (for me) to curve my fingers to hit the right keys rat…

The base idea behind keeping your fingers on the home row makes sense, as it promises that you can reach most of the commonly used keys by just curling or straightening your fingers, without moving your wrists at all. This doesn’t appear true in your picture. How does the person reach T with a finger that’s already straight, while still keeping a finger on A? This is obviously not an exact science and I’m sure you ma…

I'm not sure I can answer the first question, because I can reach the T just fine with my other finger on A and without contorting my wrist. Also, not that it changes my point, but I don't conform to a rigid version of the home-row rule or the standard touch-typing method, and I think that's how I achieve faster typing speeds than most. My hands dance around the keyboard and each movement is relative to where my fingers were on the last movement, while keeping the home row as a base. For example, in the standard method you'd use the right index finger for both Y and U. For me, if I've just typed a Y, I'll use the second finger to type U because that's more natural than re-using the index finger in different positions.

Also, just to be clear, I wasn't arguing that regular and split are the same. I have both types of keyboards and I'm planning to switch to split once I've mastered a new keyboard layout. My point was only in support of the original comment; namely, that that drawing is misleading.

Re: A beginner's guide to split keyboards

#159

Underdiscussed: The biggest difference these keyboards make: adding additional keys for the thumbs (replacing the unnecessarily large spacebar of traditional keyboards). This allows the hands to do more with the keyboard while resting the hands on home row. -- For users comfortable adding a bit of complexity for the benefit of increased expressiveness (e.g. vim users), having extra thumb keys allows bringing the full…

Yeah the thumb clusters are my favorite part of using my Kinesis Adv 360, and one of the only few things I miss when typing on a regular keyboard. Yeah the ergonomics are better but I can hit 150+ on both regular and split keyboards and never really had pain/issues with my wrists. Although I prefer the split layout more.

Re: A beginner's guide to split keyboards

#160
I really love my moonlander, the added benefit of being able to customise it specifically to my own taste has been a total game changer.

It is hilarious when others try type on it, if they can manage to get their head around the split they still have no idea how to 'use' it due to my custom layers and bindings.

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