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Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

reuters.com

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Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#151

Post by cmxch »

JKCalhoun wrote: post #31
Animats wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Although Ford's CEO now gets it, Ford's product line doesn't reflect it yet. Farley has been bringing a few sample BYD cars to the US, for Ford people to drive around and to take apart. Farley dragged his executive team to China to see a BYD plant. They came back scared. But what Ford actually sells is 1) an F-150 converted to electric, 2) a Ford Mustang converted to electric, and 3) a Ford Transit converted to elect…

"Americans only want trucks and SUVs." (I hear people say.) Cool. Then allow BYD non-trucks, non-SUVs into the U.S. then. The Japanese back in the 70's showed U.S. automakers that price and mileage (in that decade anyway) were important to Americans. I suspect price is still important.

When BYD makes an affordable clone of the Crown Vic that doesn’t phone home to the PRC, I’ll look at them.

Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#152

Post by 01100011 »

AngryData wrote: post #114
rr808 wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the issue is to create an ICE is a very complicated process requiring lots of specialist knowledge, skills and technologies. An EV is just much simpler, comes down to who has the cheapest batteries. Europe and Japan are great at the former, the latter no chance.

Im sure some of it is personal bias from experience with them but I don't think ICE are as complicated as some people think. 90% of the extra shit on them are unnecessary for it to work but what those things are and what they do and why it broke or failed or how important they are is essentially obfuscated from the general public so they seem like overly complicated magic. The vast majority of cars I see do not fail…

Optimizing costs while producing a safe, reliable, durable vehicle isn't exactly simple and requires an entire supply chain to be in place, not just a single company. Look at how many auto mfgs there are in the world that turn out terrible cars. EVs dramatically lower the parts count which helps but you still a lot of expertise to make a safe, reliable car.

Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#153

Post by cmxch »

noosphr wrote: post #17
paxys wrote: post #7

Tesla was dead in the water when it became obvious that they couldn't make a sub-$30K car happen. They will still probably do well as a luxury brand, but China is going to fill in the demand for affordable EVs in the rest of the world outside USA/EU.

I don't think we've seen the end game yet. I have an electric cargo bike. During a kids party yesterday I ran 5 different errands with it while someone with a car managed to get stuck in traffic, not find a parking spot, and miss the whole thing. The only reason why cars are the size and shape they are is because ICE engines couldn't be made smaller. Electric engines on the other hand are small enough that I can have…

They’re called golf carts.

Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#155

Post by cmxch »

surgical_fire wrote: post #62
jasonsb wrote: post #51

Tariffs might keep Chinese EVs out of the US, but they don't stop US influence from fading everywhere else. South America is voting with their wallets, and 'buy American' doesn't work when the price is double and the tech is the same. Unless the US intends to sanction every country that prioritizes value over US geopolitics, this battle is already lost.

In South America there's also no anxiety over China becoming a superpower, which may be an argument against Chinese products in the US. In fact, China has pretty good relations with most South American countries. Likely better than the US. I wouldn't be surprised if many people view China more favorably.

That won’t stop the US from practicing Monroe Doctrine to limit Chinese influence.

Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#156

Post by energy123 »

vel0city wrote: post #130
energy123 wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why the 120% price difference between China and South America?

Different government subsidies, different manufacturing costs, different regulatory requirements, and different markets have different market competition. Think about this concept. It costs you $1 to make a widget. It costs your competitors $1.25 to make a similar widget. They sell theirs for $5. Do you sell yours for $1.50 or $4.75? Obviously, other things could be in play for the market for widgets, but if you coul…

A lot of this makes sense. But why would South America's consumer market be less competitive than China? If China's low prices are caused by, say, 3 Chinese brands competing with each other, why can't those 3 Chinese brands also compete with each other in South America?

Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#158

Post by JojoFatsani »

juujian wrote: post #2

Not just Tesla, all established brands we know are left behind. I never understood Volkswagen's pivot from 'wait and See's to 'were inversing billions' to 'we were too late, abort'. Largest brands n terms of units, completely left behind in an emerging segment that's already dominating it's largest market (China). So many executives in the industry just didn't see the writing on the wall. I don't what GM was thinking…

Dieselgate put VW on the back foot at almost exactly the wrong time in automotive history.

Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#159

Post by more_corn »

01100011 wrote: post #150
dzonga wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla has no moat 1. Batteries - BYD has them beat 2. Self Driving tech - other players are better 3. Luxury brands already provide the luxury aspect & even better built cars 4. in the US they're being saved by US protectionism. in Europe etc - we already see the chinese brands making inroads for EV sales

Tesla also has a big Elon problem in that the blue cities where self-driving Taxis will be most profitable may opt for Waymo or boycott Tesla over politics.

I’m not going to allow “Nazi salutes” to be downgraded to “politics”. It’s still too soon to be a Nazi. Hopefully it will always be.

Re: Electric vehicle sales are booming in South America – without Tesla

#160

Post by kevin_thibedeau »

moffkalast wrote: post #82
toomuchtodo wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

BYD recently went live with a highly automated, large scale manufacturing facility in Brazil. The BYD Dolphin Mini sells for ~$22,500, and the manufacturer already has 200 showrooms open across the country. https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2025/11/22/cop-brazil... https://www.byd.com/us/news-list/First-BYD-Electric-Vehicle-...

I'm surprised Mercedes was ever price competitive for taxis even in Germany, I mean the average VW would do the job just as well at half the cost. These days they're both priced like they're selling Ferraris anyway so yeah. The ID Buzz starting at 70k EUR is such a joke.

They used to make them with quality construction. Now it's all engineered with plastic bits that will only last for the first 5 years the rich owner will be using it before tossing it out.
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