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What if we made advertising illegal?

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Re: What if we made advertising illegal?

#151

Post by WalterBright »

dr_dshiv wrote: post #135
WalterBright wrote: post #25

Who is going to know about your product if you cannot advertise it?

I guess the idea is to ban certain types of advertising. It’s a fun thought experiment and practical — it’s why some country roads don’t have billboards and some do. Going to a conference to promote your product to participants.. Do you allow the shills to shill? Well, shills gonna shill— I sure wish I promoted my businesses more. It is uncomfortable at times but that’s not really a good excuse to not promote what yo…

I agree that billboards are a form of "visual pollution" that blocks scenic views. But paying for an ad on the side of a bus isn't a problem.

No, I don't think we need to argue about where the line between the two is.

Re: What if we made advertising illegal?

#152

Post by pishpash »

imiric wrote: post #127
toomim wrote: post #10

This begs the question: how could you reliably distinguish advertising from other forms of free speech? The courts already distinguish "commercial speech" as a class of speech. Would we prevent all forms of commercial speech? What about a waiter asking you "would you like to try a rosé with that dish? It pairs very well together." Is that "advertising" that would need to be outlawed? What about giving out free sample…

We don't need to go into absurd discussions in order to prevent 99% of the harm that comes from modern advertising. The line is clear: is money being exchanged in order to promote a product? That's advertising. Someone I know mentioning a product because they want to recommend it to me? Not advertising. Giving out "free" samples? Presumably someone is being paid to do that, so advertising. We can later quibble about…

Why not just eliminate the sale of personal data? That seems pretty cut and dry.

Re: What if we made advertising illegal?

#153

Post by tppiotrowski »

uniq7 wrote: post #122
01HNNWZ0MV43FF wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many lines are hard to draw but we benefit from trying to draw them. Worrying too much would be bikeshedding The biggest example that comes to mind is gambling. Japan says it's not gambling if the pachinko place gives you balls and then you have to walk next door to a "different" company to cash out the balls. I say it sounds like their laws are captured by the pachinko industry. Video game loot boxes are technically…

Any laws with blurred lines will be used by the people in power against their political adversaries to keep them in power.

I agree with this. Any law that's not universally enforced: speeding, jaywalking, tax audit, etc is a tool for political persecution.

Re: What if we made advertising illegal?

#154

Post by mikestew »

iambateman wrote: post #57

To go halfway to the extreme of this article, I think banning large-scale billboards in my city would make a big difference. It feels like having a calmer public space is more in the public interest than reminding them to drink Miller Lite.

Redmond, WA has a ban on billboards. Locals can see this demonstrated by driving 124th St. and crossing Willows Rd into Kirkland. First thing you’ll see are billboards.

Just got back from a trip to Florida. Billboards along every freeway, and 75% of them are personal injury lawyers. If you’re a resident of Redmond, it is an obnoxious contrast.

Re: What if we made advertising illegal?

#156

Post by SecretDreams »

toomim wrote: post #10

This begs the question: how could you reliably distinguish advertising from other forms of free speech? The courts already distinguish "commercial speech" as a class of speech. Would we prevent all forms of commercial speech? What about a waiter asking you "would you like to try a rosé with that dish? It pairs very well together." Is that "advertising" that would need to be outlawed? What about giving out free sample…

No paid advertising, whether that involves financial compensation, in kind gifts, or something else.

There would be no commercial ads online if google received no kickbacks to show ads. There would be no influencers, either. I'd be okay with non-profits and government agencies advertising benevolent things to us, like vaccinations.

The only hard part is to develop systems to actually ensure nobody is receiving compensation if they are showing a product.

I'd also be fine to make exceptions for internal advertising, e.g. you're already on the Google website and Google is advertising their own products/services to you.

Re: What if we made advertising illegal?

#157

Post by pishpash »

OmarShehata wrote: post #147
imiric wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We don't need to go into absurd discussions in order to prevent 99% of the harm that comes from modern advertising. The line is clear: is money being exchanged in order to promote a product? That's advertising. Someone I know mentioning a product because they want to recommend it to me? Not advertising. Giving out "free" samples? Presumably someone is being paid to do that, so advertising. We can later quibble about…

> The line is clear: is money being exchanged in order to promote a product? That's advertising. this is obviously not a clear line. No money is exchanged when I promote my own product through my own channels, nor when I promote my friends products, whether I disclose it as promotion, or disguise it as my genuine unaffiliated opinion. Sometimes it really is a genuine opinion! Even worse: sometimes a genuine opinion b…

Yellow books used to do that. Because you're right it's a matchmatching problem.

Re: What if we made advertising illegal?

#158

Post by ksec »

>It's such a wild idea that I've never heard it in the public discourse.

>Algorithm-driven platforms like Instagram and TikTok that harvest and monetize attention, destroying youth, would lose their economic foundation.

I guess the author has never been on HN.

This simply assumes Instagram would no longer function because of zero ad placement dollars. I guess the author doesn't know how KOLs works in product launch and promotion.

I get a lot of stick every time I had to say this, but a lot of people in tech, has a very simplistic view that all ads are evil without understanding how ad works in the first place. Especially beyond digital ad. And to make matter worst any discussions about Ad's argument has been downvoted in the past 10-12 years. Some of the questions which toomim purpose would be instantly dropped. I guess the vibe shift is real.

But if there is one type of ad we should ban. It would be political ads. A candidate's legitimacy should not be partly dependent on amount of ad money you throw at it.

Re: What if we made advertising illegal?

#159

Post by drilbo »

logicchains wrote: post #66
lukev wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. Advertising is a zero-sum game. If nobody advertised, every solution would be equally discoverable via search and word-of-mouth. It's only when some actors start advertising that the others must as well, so they don't fall behind. And so billions of dollars are spent that could have gone to making better products. It's basically the prisoner's dilemma at scale.

>If nobody advertised, every solution would be equally discoverable via search and word-of-mouth. No it wouldn't. If someone opens up a new restaurant a block away there's not going to be much word of mouth when it just opened, and even if they make a website, web search will prioritise the websites of existing restaurants because their domains have been around longer and have more inbound links.

well, web search is one thing that would look very different

Re: What if we made advertising illegal?

#160

Post by pishpash »

1970-01-01 wrote: post #155

If we're going to do the extremely hard thing , why not just make ads opt-in: Your meal will cost $2.39 less if you watch an advertisement for Irish Spring soap and another for Liberty Mutual insurance. Do you accept these terms?

That's typically not the target audience you want, people who are not willing to spend money and whose time is worthless.
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