Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The great Hobby Lobby artifact heist

meghanboilard.substack.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

151–160 of 214 posts

Re: The great Hobby Lobby artifact heist

#151

Post by Arainach »

lurk2 wrote: post #141
Arainach wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no relevant contradiction. The entire New Testament is Jesus preaching love and forgiveness, Jesus practicing love and forgiveness - and not just to his followers - and explicit condemnation of wealth and instructing his followers to care for others. Anyone who takes that message and instead lobbies to destroy healthcare and welfare and to push hate and attack anyone who doesn't agree with them - and anyone…

While I don’t want to look like I’m going to bat for the Hobby Lobby people, this seems like a very convenient way for you to argue that everyone ought to agree with your policy positions, even when those policy positions are not explicitly biblical. How do you reconcile the welfare state with Thessalonians 3:10, or Matthew 7:6? How do you address the restoration of Job? Was God mistaken in awarding Job with material…

Other humans are not "dogs" or "pigs".

Jesus was unambiguous. "And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength. The second is this: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these." (Mark 12:30–31)

Or, even more explicit, Matthew 25:31-46.

"Then the righteous will answer him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink? And when did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you? And when did we see you sick or in prison and visit you?’ And the King will answer them, ‘Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.’"

Jesus is explicitly advocating welfare - providing food, drink, clothes, healthcare, and more to anyone in need.

Jesus was also unambiguous on wealth. Christians, who follow the teachings of Christ, should give greater merit to his words than to anything in the old testament which came before.

For more, consider 1 John 4:20 "Whoever claims to love God yet hates a brother or sister is a liar. For whoever does not love their brother and sister, whom they have seen, cannot love God, whom they have not seen."

Re: The great Hobby Lobby artifact heist

#152

Post by ultimafan »

watwut wrote: post #147
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, keep doing what you're doing then. I mean, we really showed them, the religious right is certainly in retreat after all that shaming.

They literally vote for the most insulting person available, again and again. If anything, Trumps winning twice and conservatives in general getting votes is that being polite and nice is completely failing strategy. Democrats and centrists were nice and respectful for years while conservative were increasingly insulting ... and increasingly oversensitive creating outrages over nothing. This demand for one sided nice…

>Democrats and centrists were nice and respectful for years

This is only really true on the political level, not the cultural/social level. Politicians on the left have been significantly more respectful than their counterparts for a long time now. But the same can't really be said for the sentiments of their voter base or the media/education curated towards them. For a large amount of people what they see and experience in their day to day lives does more to color their beliefs than what a politician says that they have no relation to and might see a few sound bites of here and there running up to an election.

The left has to learn that telling a prospective voter repeatedly that they are the enemy won't make anyone want to support them unless they're already believers. It'll just push them towards the side that's offering to call them an ally.

Re: The great Hobby Lobby artifact heist

#153

Post by wrp »

turtlesdown11 wrote: post #142
wrp wrote: post #128

Many upvotes here due to the political/religious aspect, but there should be some comment on the archeological issue. From what I've gathered in the past, the main points are: 1. An organization with very deep pockets sets out to collect Near Eastern antiquities. 2. Due to turmoil in the Middle East, many relics of dubious provenance are hitting the market. 3. The org decides to buy as much of this stuff as they can,…

The claims made above with regard to 3 and 4 are false. https://www.ice.gov/news/releases/hobby-lobby-settles-3-mill...

The article confirms #3 and contradicts #4.

Re: The great Hobby Lobby artifact heist

#154

Post by toasterlovin »

RandomBacon wrote: post #114
emchammer wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of it is just about maintaining healthy boundaries. I am a transgender person of faith. It’s not really a big deal except for the assholes.

I find it interesting that the Episocopal Chirch in the United States has both old conservative members and young liberal members, and they all seem to get along as far as I can tell (many of them also believe in Theistic Evolution and don't shun science like others seem to think). I think it's a flavor of conservatism that is more libertarian. The Episcopal Church also has openly-gay priests and women priests, all o…

FWIW, conservative Episcopalians splintered and are no longer part of the same church. They're called Anglicans now.

Re: The great Hobby Lobby artifact heist

#155

Post by __MatrixMan__ »

RandomBacon wrote: post #121
flocciput wrote: post #50

Is it just me or has HN as a whole become... more Christian lately? A lot more defensive comments here than I would've expected, and I've seen in other threads people actually openly recommending religion/Christianity specifically as something that solved their problems. What's the deal here? I would've thought this would be a relatively atheist/agnostic community, if not one that eschews discussion of religion entir…

Maybe people are more comfortable sharing online and in less fear of being ganged up on?

Are you proposing that now is a safer time to express oneself online than any other time? The idea that my online speech could make me the target of offline violence feels realer than ever now that AI can do the legwork of correlating my identities.

Re: The great Hobby Lobby artifact heist

#156

Post by chuckadams »

WillPostForFood wrote: post #125
turtlesdown11 wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It affected a tiny portion of the population. > According to a 2009 research paper from NYU Stern School of Business, these corporations account for 52 percent of private employment and 51 percent of private-sector output in the country. Those percentages might be outdated now but still give a sense of just how many workers are employed at closely held corporations. Fifty-two percent of today’s private sector emplo…

And in the following paragraph: Of course it’s extremely unlikely that all of those companies are about to claim a religious exemption from providing coverage of contraception. Aaron Blake at the Washington Post points to a Kaiser Family Foundation poll that found that 85 percent of large employers offered contraception coverage prior to Obamacare requiring it. Regardless, this is nitpicking, and the grandparent clai…

It's nice that these corporations have the noblesse oblige to provide us the healthcare benefits that morally speaking should be ours by constitutional right.

Re: The great Hobby Lobby artifact heist

#157

Post by chuckadams »

gadders wrote: post #101
armchairhacker wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Although it sounds very bad, there’s actually a good argument for paying disabled workers below-minimum wage: - Disabled people get paid (what is supposed to be, but not actually, a living wage) by the government, so they aren’t living on the wage. - No company would hire them if they were forced to pay minimum wage, because companies are greedy and would always hire a more productive non-disabled worker. - Many disa…

Yes, there was debate about this in the UK. If a disabled person can only do one widget per hour, and an able-bodied can do 10, what is the correct wage for that disabled person? If you think they should both be paid the same, who should pay the additional cost?

> If you think they should both be paid the same, who should pay the additional cost?

The taxpayer, in the form of a direct wage subsidy. Comes out to virtually nothing compared to the amount of corporate welfare we shovel out every day. The company still isn't compelled to hire the disabled person if they won't be effective on the job, but companies that were inclined to hire them before still will, pay the same amount as before, and we taxpayers will pay the price tag of a bomber or two to ensure that some people have some independence and dignity.

Which of course is why such a thing will never happen here.

Re: The great Hobby Lobby artifact heist

#158

Post by chuckadams »

ck2 wrote: post #133
smithkl42 wrote: post #7

I wish the author was a little less over-wrought in her descriptions of the Green family's religious commitments. I've heard complaints before about the Green's artifact acquisition process, and they've had to return some manuscripts: it's a story worth investigating and telling. But it distracts from the author's main point when she's making snide comments about their faith. Yes, they're Christians who are successfu…

Of course religion should be treated with sarcasm It singlehandedly has held back the world for centuries, caused the suffering and death of millions if not billions. It's completely made up, thousands of years before anyone knew anything about anything and then as science is learned the world is bent to its superstitions and not the other way around because it can never ever change because some ignorant dude said so…

Every religion stole from every other. That's what cultural exchange is.

Re: The great Hobby Lobby artifact heist

#159

Post by chuckadams »

ultimafan wrote: post #152
watwut wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They literally vote for the most insulting person available, again and again. If anything, Trumps winning twice and conservatives in general getting votes is that being polite and nice is completely failing strategy. Democrats and centrists were nice and respectful for years while conservative were increasingly insulting ... and increasingly oversensitive creating outrages over nothing. This demand for one sided nice…

>Democrats and centrists were nice and respectful for years This is only really true on the political level, not the cultural/social level. Politicians on the left have been significantly more respectful than their counterparts for a long time now. But the same can't really be said for the sentiments of their voter base or the media/education curated towards them. For a large amount of people what they see and experi…

> Politicians on the left have been significantly more respectful than their counterparts for a long time now.

And that's why they're losing.

Re: The great Hobby Lobby artifact heist

#160

Post by anonfordays »

duped wrote: post #21
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Completely agree. I think the author's tone in this article, in a nutshell, exemplifies what was a huge driving force of so many evangelical's in the US now being firmly in the MAGA camp, even though that seems paradoxical to many of us. For a long time now, many people who's religious values are deeply important to them have felt disrespected and looked down upon by "the left" (yes, I'm obviously painting with a bro…

Some beliefs deserve to be looked down upon and disrespected because they are backwards. I wouldn't call them "silly" because they're very serious. I don't believe in treating religious fundamentalists with compassion and empathy anymore. That's how we got the nutjobs in power, by not deriding them enough in public and private. There can be no tolerance of hate, and the people you are talking about are motivated by h…

Some beliefs deserve to be looked down upon and disrespected because they are backwards. I wouldn't call them "silly" because they're very serious.

I don't believe in treating religious fundamentalists with compassion and empathy anymore. That's how we got the peace trucks, by not deriding them enough in public and private. There can be no tolerance of hate, and the people you are talking about are motivated by hate of others.

Post reply on HN