Earlier quoted context omitted.
The shocking part to me is that Indian news is usually conducted in English so it's not even inaccessible. It's written by English speakers for English speakers, yet everyone seems mystified at what goes on in the subcontinent Like I get why people find it difficult to understand Mandarin. But this is English news we're talking about ...
If you want the CCP propaganda in English, you have plenty of material out there I think, you don't even need those trivial to use machine translators.
Sri Lanka scrambles to restore power after monkey causes islandwide outage
151–160 of 161 posts
Re: Sri Lanka scrambles to restore power after monkey causes islandwide outage
#152Earlier quoted context omitted.
All those Ukrainians basking in that tremendous Russian empathy… It only takes a moment for you or your loved ones to receive death or grievous injury, but not to worry because they’re “spending an exceedingly small amount of time engaged in violence”. Rape might be over in minutes! And besides, it only affects… how much of the population? Those who are most confident about human righteousness are the least qualified…
This is clearly a disagreement about weights. You don't seem to weigh empathy and joy very highly in comparison to violence. How much kind empathetic deeds do you think it takes to outweigh 10 minutes of violent murder? A hug? A romance? A lifetime of Love? One hundred lifetimes of kindness? Sometimes it helps to make the context personal? How much violence would you endure for a year of kindness and love?
With regards to the weight of violence: Have you considered that "10 minutes of violent murder" may mean only 10 minutes of acute agony for the deceased but years of suffering for the deceased's surviving loved ones?
The only possible answer to your thought experiment is "I don't need s1artibartfast sitting in judgment about whether my life is appropriately balanced between violence and happiness".
Re: Sri Lanka scrambles to restore power after monkey causes islandwide outage
#153Earlier quoted context omitted.
The big genocides and mass murders of the twentieth century were motivated by non-religious (the holocaust) or atheist (in the Soviet union, China, and Cambodia) ideologies.. Even historically religious motives for "bad behaviours" were rare.
Were those genocides really motivated by of a lack of religion or other factors like racism and authoritarianism? > Even historically religious motives for "bad behaviours" were rare. Doubt. Still, even if that's accurate, my point was that raising people to be easily manipulated sheep doesn't produce a robust society. It just makes them easier to exploit. MLMs are common in predominantly Mormon communities for a rea…
You misunderstand what I said. I was refuting the idea that religion caused genocides, rather than claiming lack of religion caused genocides.
I think religion per se is too generic and varied to correlate with anything. Sometimes the lack of a particular religion or variant of a particular religion may either cause or oppose genocide - there is a reason, for example, that the Nazis wanted to replace Christianity with new religions, (Positive Christianity and new-paganism - both very different from the originals they drew on/pretended to be), consistent with their ideology.
Re: Sri Lanka scrambles to restore power after monkey causes islandwide outage
#154Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's constantly used in polemics of Christianity. Whereas actions of atheists are unable to be used against atheism
> It's constantly used in polemics of Christianity. Doesn't make it true though. > Whereas actions of atheists are unable to be used against atheism Why not, aside from the obvious observation that "atheists" are not as homogenuous in their belief as, say, "Catholics". In general the actions of, say, Nazis, can be used against them (ie Nazis) but not against humans globally or atheists in Australia, that's nonsensica…
Only if people are doing something because they are Catholics.
Atheist polemicists often treat the actions of any (supposed, in many cases) Christian as an objection to Christianity in general, which is just as nonsensical. That is what is objectionable in their argument.
Re: Sri Lanka scrambles to restore power after monkey causes islandwide outage
#155Earlier quoted context omitted.
> It's constantly used in polemics of Christianity. Doesn't make it true though. > Whereas actions of atheists are unable to be used against atheism Why not, aside from the obvious observation that "atheists" are not as homogenuous in their belief as, say, "Catholics". In general the actions of, say, Nazis, can be used against them (ie Nazis) but not against humans globally or atheists in Australia, that's nonsensica…
> Why not, aside from the obvious observation that "atheists" are not as homogenous in their belief as, say, "Catholics". Only if people are doing something because they are Catholics. Atheist polemicists often treat the actions of any (supposed, in many cases) Christian as an objection to Christianity in general, which is just as nonsensical. That is what is objectionable in their argument.
I'm sure some do .. I'll even grant that most online that engage in such arguments likely do.
I'd suggest the bulk of atheists don't spend much time pointlessly going around and around in such circles.
The "common tactics" of "Atheist polemicists" presented here so far are just daft - they're more the hallmark of obsessives that engage in oline forum textfests.
> Only if people are doing something because they are Catholics.
The statement I made was that "atheists" are not as homogeneous in their belief as, say, "Catholics".
I stand by it.
I would also suggest that Mormons are more homogeneous as a group than "atheists", the Greek Orthodox are more homogeneous as a group than "atheists", etc.
If people engage in activities under the organisational overwatch of the Catholic Church, eg: the Christian Brothers in Bindoon, then the Catholic Church bears responsibility for allowing those actions to proceed unchecked.
Re: Sri Lanka scrambles to restore power after monkey causes islandwide outage
#156Earlier quoted context omitted.
The wikipedia page is one sided and only puts the case for calling iu a genocide. As a mixed race and entirely ethnic minority Sri Lankan who lived there for much of the civil war I do not think genocide is an accurate characterisation, although there were certainly many atrocities. It was also made possible by the populations fear of the other side who were extremely nasty ethnonationalists, "ethnically cleansed" ar…
I read your comment because I thought it would provide another perspective on the situation, which is always a good thing. However, the link you shared as well as your rhetoric only made me more sympathetic towards the Tamil minority. Here's my understanding on the conflict. 1. The Sinhalese majority were given mandate by the British. 2. They used this mandate to apply incredibly discriminatory practices towards the…
No. They were a simple majority so took control through elections. They felt discriminated against, and that the British favoured Tamils and Christians..
> 2. They used this mandate to apply incredibly discriminatory practices towards the Tamils.
True. mostly over language. Minorities in general were disadvantaged.
> 3. Constant rabble-rousing by Sinhalese politicians intermittently led to race riots, in which Sinhalese mobs carried out pogroms and murders against Tamils.
True, but this was on a small scale until after the war actually started. Other groups (such as Muslims and Christians) were also targetted.
if you read the article about the "progrom" it was preceded by the LTTE murdering a Tamil policeman, and intimidating others.
> 4. Due to almost laughably blatant policies targeting Tamils, such as an affirmative action policy designed to reduce the number of Tamil students at universities, a group of Tamil students formed a league to protest the matter. These students would become the forerunners of the tamil militant group
True to an extent, but the affirmative action was also targetted at helping poor and rural students vs affluent ones. The core of the system was basically giving extra points to those from schools and areas that did not historically get students into university. For the language based part, how is this different from race based affirmative action in the US? The idea was to boost numbers of historically underrepresented groups.
> 5. Further barbarism from the Sinhalese majority, such as the destruction of culturally important Tamil heritage (for instance, the destruction of an important library), seeding racial tensions.
Mostly the burning of Jaffna Library. Horrible, but not an excuse for atrocities.
> 6. A rebel group carries out an ambush against the Sri Lankan army, seemingly as retaliation for the assassination of one of their commanders.
That is roughly right. The race riots were horrible. I know a lot of people who were affected and traumatised by it. That does not justify doing the same back.
The LTTE was also utterly ruthless to Tamils who failed to support it. They completely wiped out other Tamil militant groups to consolidate their hold on power, they raised money from abroad by threatening people's families in Sri Lanka, they targetted Tamils in the armed forces.
Most ethnonationalism is a reaction to some real or perceived wrong. You will end up justifying everything on those grounds.
> The only consistent perspective that Sri Lankan commentators seem to provide in their support for the killing of civilians is their strong belief that Sri Lanka must be a Buddhist nation and that Buddhism has a special place in the state constitution
You are only reading bigots then. Most people who do defend it will tell you killing civilians was an inevitable result of war - collateral damage.
I know very few Sri Lankans from ethnic or religious minorities who support the LTTE or even feel that their actions were even remotely justified. I am mixed race (entirely minority, Tamil on my mother's side ) and Christian (as are most of my family). I have worked in a Tamil suburb of the capital city and many people there felt that they were oppressed by both the Sinhalese and the LTTE. I know people from all the major ethnic groups and religions and everyone opposes the LTTE.
You also need to take into account that the motive for the LTTE's violence was also racial oppression with Tamil people - the low castes by the high castes. I think this is why Tamils (both Hindu and Christian) turned to violence, while Christians from other ethnic groups did not (apart from the 1962 coup attempt) and Muslims (apart from the Easter bombings which were an exception there was the odd riot) rarely did. That opinion comes from talking to people who know Jaffna well (including my father who used to run the civil service in the peninsula).
> The sexual violence that seemingly became routine for Tamil
What makes you think it was routine? There is no evidence that it was encouraged as policy or a weapon or war (as say happened with Bangladesh broke from Pakistan, among other instances).
> We treated the Tamils like subhumans, actively discriminated them into poverty and kept murdering them and rioting in their areas. Now they're fighting back, so we're justified in committing genocide
That is a gross exaggeration. My mother would have laughed at the idea that she was treated as subhuman, as would my relatives on that side of the family, or my Tamil friends.
Discrimination is no excuse for terrorism or ethnic cleansing. Would black Americans be justified in bombing white majority areas, driving white people out of black areas etc? it is far more true to say they were historically treated as subhuman than that Sri Lankan Tamils were!
Re: Sri Lanka scrambles to restore power after monkey causes islandwide outage
#157Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Why not, aside from the obvious observation that "atheists" are not as homogenous in their belief as, say, "Catholics". Only if people are doing something because they are Catholics. Atheist polemicists often treat the actions of any (supposed, in many cases) Christian as an objection to Christianity in general, which is just as nonsensical. That is what is objectionable in their argument.
> Atheist polemicists often treat I'm sure some do .. I'll even grant that most online that engage in such arguments likely do. I'd suggest the bulk of atheists don't spend much time pointlessly going around and around in such circles. The "common tactics" of "Atheist polemicists" presented here so far are just daft - they're more the hallmark of obsessives that engage in oline forum textfests. > Only if people are d…
Its pretty common to do so.
For example, blaming the Spanish inquisition (an arm of the Spanish monarchy) on the Catholic Church, or people claiming that Hitler was a Catholic (without adding the important "as a child" qualifier).
> would also suggest that Mormons are more homogeneous as a group than "atheists", the Greek Orthodox are more homogeneous as a group than "atheists", etc.
Going back to what I said earlier, the original point was religion vs lack of religion - and I would argue that religious people (Christians, Hindus, pagans, ....) are a less homogenous group than atheists.
Re: Sri Lanka scrambles to restore power after monkey causes islandwide outage
#158Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is clearly a disagreement about weights. You don't seem to weigh empathy and joy very highly in comparison to violence. How much kind empathetic deeds do you think it takes to outweigh 10 minutes of violent murder? A hug? A romance? A lifetime of Love? One hundred lifetimes of kindness? Sometimes it helps to make the context personal? How much violence would you endure for a year of kindness and love?
If Russians were sufficiently empathetic towards the suffering of Ukrainians, if they truly felt the pain of Ukrainians as keenly as if they had experienced it themselves , they wouldn't freaking invade. But since empathy is a weak force and it's human nature to not feel much about the suffering of outsiders, Russians are not dissuaded from their war of conquest. With regards to the weight of violence: Have you consi…
To be clear, I'm not judging your life, but challenging your claim about the forces driving human behavior, and the aggregate vale of the species.
I disagree with the idea that just because empathy doesn't prevent all violence, it is weak, or less meaningful. A bird can fly, but that doesn't mean gravity is weak.
Violence is real, and important to understand, but Empathy and good intentions are real too, and a huge part of human psychology. I would argue they are a greater driver of the two.
Re: Sri Lanka scrambles to restore power after monkey causes islandwide outage
#159Re: Sri Lanka scrambles to restore power after monkey causes islandwide outage
#160Earlier quoted context omitted.
If Russians were sufficiently empathetic towards the suffering of Ukrainians, if they truly felt the pain of Ukrainians as keenly as if they had experienced it themselves , they wouldn't freaking invade. But since empathy is a weak force and it's human nature to not feel much about the suffering of outsiders, Russians are not dissuaded from their war of conquest. With regards to the weight of violence: Have you consi…
That is falling back to the purity tests and cynicism. To be clear, I'm not judging your life, but challenging your claim about the forces driving human behavior, and the aggregate vale of the species. I disagree with the idea that just because empathy doesn't prevent all violence, it is weak, or less meaningful. A bird can fly, but that doesn't mean gravity is weak. Violence is real, and important to understand, but…
I imagine, for example, that government officials involved in managing California water rights[1], have "good intentions" — just as good as the intentions of those in this thread offering monstrous philosophical propositions about bartering violence that trivialize its enduring damage, or the intentions of those who contemplate becoming "nature's ethical guardians" and reducing "sentient suffering".
To the extent that human social systems have evolved to reduce "sentient suffering", it has been by applying forcible restraints on such individuals, confronting them with how the consequences of their actions affect others, even when the natural human inclination is to downplay and dismiss suffering when it clashes with self-interest or "good intentions".