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JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

blog.jetbrains.com

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Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#151

Post by mavamaarten »

rhubarbtree wrote: post #133
b_e_n_t_o_n wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My only problem with jetbrains UI is that it's slow. Night and day difference using even vscode, let alone vim, sublime, helix, zed, etc. I tolerate it because the functionality it brings, but I find myself actually writing code in something faster. And I don't see fleet improving on this in a meaningful way - it's basically a competitor to vscode, which I don't use for the same reasons I won't use fleet. There is a…

No complaints on my MacBook Air M2. What machine are you on? It’s definitely not as fast to load etc as say sublime, but it’s an IDE not an editor.

Well.. I'm running it on an M3 and it can be truly slow. Not always! But opening up a package inside a multi-module Kotlin project can literally take 10 seconds. Which isn't much seeing how great of an IDE it is and how much time it saves because it is so powerful. But it's heavy alright. Every time I see new features I don't really use, I wish they would invest in trimming fat instead.

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#152

Post by MortyWaves »

joseda-hg wrote: post #143
MortyWaves wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve been trying DataGrip for SQL stuff after Azure Data Studio (a closed source fork of VS Code) was recently deprecated. It has all the same UI problems I remember of their other IDEs like WebStorm. Clunky and weird looking, and that’s coming from someone that appreciates generally Windows 9x style controls and palette, JetBrains just can’t get it right. As a side note one of the advertised features of DataGrip is…

Ostensibly it's not one of the main features, Datagrip as a product has been a thing long before AI integration was even a thought

It’s absolutely front and center of its marketing page.

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#153

Post by juped »

b_e_n_t_o_n wrote: post #76
solardev wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think Fleet's their hopeful answer to VSCode. IntelliJ is powerful, but so, so messy, with a convoluted UI from the 90s/2000s. Even the simplified one is much klunklier than VSCode, especially for everyday/every-hour tasks like NPM scripts, debugging, etc. Every essential function is hidden in tiny competing side panels triggered by some obscure icon in a different part of the screen. I love and use Jetbrains IDEs…

My only problem with jetbrains UI is that it's slow. Night and day difference using even vscode, let alone vim, sublime, helix, zed, etc. I tolerate it because the functionality it brings, but I find myself actually writing code in something faster. And I don't see fleet improving on this in a meaningful way - it's basically a competitor to vscode, which I don't use for the same reasons I won't use fleet. There is a…

Slow? Jetbrains IDEs, slow? Compared to, of all things, the LSP-reliant VS Code?

I pay for them primarily to save me from LSP, which they do for many languages, though the Elixir plugin is not by Jetbrains (but it actually predates LSP itself).

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#154

Post by bayindirh »

Kuinox wrote: post #149
bayindirh wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe all of them are configurable in Rider, no?

You can also configure the VS Code UX.

That's not the question. The question was "you can change the toolbars and shortcuts in JetBrains Rider, no?"

I presume the answer is yes, from what you said. Then it becomes less of an issue, if not an non-issue.

IDEs and code editors are tools which we live with for a long time. Nobody expects their defaults to be unchanged. Otherwise we'd be all using notepad.exe for coding.

Not having the defaults organized by your tastes is not a valid reason for disqualifying a tool out of the gate.

As a counter example, Electron's font rendering is nothing to drool over, from my perspective, and doesn't give an extra point for using it in my case.

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#155

Post by lpapez »

bayindirh wrote: post #134
rhubarbtree wrote: post #130

Anyone wondering whether JetBrains IDEs are still worth it - absolute yes from me. VS code is a UX mess by comparison. Webstorm can be tricky to configure with Typescript but once it’s setup my goodness it’s good.

Unfortunately many new developers don't believe in powerful "power" tools anymore. They like to connect many small tools for an inferior experience and they just scoff at bigger tools for being "too complicated". I use another big tool which is around 20 years old, and that can do everything and a ton more from a single screen at the same speed or faster, with greater integration. Yet people don't touch it because it…

In my case it is because I am wary of these tools breaking in a way which cannot be fixed, or services being suddenly revoked for external reasons.

Example: now that I'm a solopreneur I use JetBrains DataGrip, and overall I am very pleased with it. But I couldn't have it on my previous two jobs. One of the jobs restricted my work computer to only allow MySQL Workbench (arbitrary Powershell scripts also were allowed, of course), and the other one didn't want to pay for a licence, no matter how much I pleaded.

So before I had to make due with (admittedly) inferior tools because they were free and available as the lowest common denominator in the general workplace.

Being comfortable with the tools affects a large part of my productivity, and I'm more productive with a crappy-but-familiar toolbox than I am with the unknown spaceship.

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#156

Post by nedsma »

rhubarbtree wrote: post #130

Anyone wondering whether JetBrains IDEs are still worth it - absolute yes from me. VS code is a UX mess by comparison. Webstorm can be tricky to configure with Typescript but once it’s setup my goodness it’s good.

Contrary to that, I used Jetbrains IDEs for a decade, or even longer, and recently I have switched to VS Code for my Go and TypeScript work. Sometimes less is more.

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#157

Post by bayindirh »

lpapez wrote: post #155
bayindirh wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately many new developers don't believe in powerful "power" tools anymore. They like to connect many small tools for an inferior experience and they just scoff at bigger tools for being "too complicated". I use another big tool which is around 20 years old, and that can do everything and a ton more from a single screen at the same speed or faster, with greater integration. Yet people don't touch it because it…

In my case it is because I am wary of these tools breaking in a way which cannot be fixed, or services being suddenly revoked for external reasons. Example: now that I'm a solopreneur I use JetBrains DataGrip, and overall I am very pleased with it. But I couldn't have it on my previous two jobs. One of the jobs restricted my work computer to only allow MySQL Workbench (arbitrary Powershell scripts also were allowed,…

All of the tools I use are free software and actively maintained and updated, plus they have very nice logging, so I can diagnose what's happening. I only needed to read the logs because I was young and experimenting with the parts I shouldn't and broke the thing on purpose. However, you can just create a copy of the installation directory to back it up completely.

Again, the tool I gave as an example has integrated configuration snapshots, and if something breaks I can revert to a config 2 seconds or 2 years before, including component versions installed at that time.

To be honest, I probably used that feature at most two times in the last 20 years.

Workplace restrictions something off-limits and I can't tell anything about. The people I gave examples are persons I know and they have no such restrictions in place.

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#158

Post by nicce »

alde wrote: post #138
rhubarbtree wrote: post #130

Anyone wondering whether JetBrains IDEs are still worth it - absolute yes from me. VS code is a UX mess by comparison. Webstorm can be tricky to configure with Typescript but once it’s setup my goodness it’s good.

I have moved to VScode after being a paying Jetbrains customer for 6 years. The Jetbrains IDEs are clunky and slow, they also have plenty of bugs which remain open for years. They do offer some really powerful refactoring capabilities but I don’t miss them. Most of my work is in Go, Rust and Typescript. I was told by Jetbrains representatives that Fleet is now deprioritized internally, which is a pity.

> they also have plenty of bugs which remain open for years.

I switch to Jetbrains from time to time because there are many impassable serious bugs in VSCode, on the other hand…

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#159

Post by anoother »

bayindirh wrote: post #134
rhubarbtree wrote: post #130

Anyone wondering whether JetBrains IDEs are still worth it - absolute yes from me. VS code is a UX mess by comparison. Webstorm can be tricky to configure with Typescript but once it’s setup my goodness it’s good.

Unfortunately many new developers don't believe in powerful "power" tools anymore. They like to connect many small tools for an inferior experience and they just scoff at bigger tools for being "too complicated". I use another big tool which is around 20 years old, and that can do everything and a ton more from a single screen at the same speed or faster, with greater integration. Yet people don't touch it because it…

What's the tool?

Re: JetBrains Fleet drops support for Kotlin Multiplatform

#160

Post by bayindirh »

anoother wrote: post #159
bayindirh wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately many new developers don't believe in powerful "power" tools anymore. They like to connect many small tools for an inferior experience and they just scoff at bigger tools for being "too complicated". I use another big tool which is around 20 years old, and that can do everything and a ton more from a single screen at the same speed or faster, with greater integration. Yet people don't touch it because it…

What's the tool?

Eclipse. Coincidentally used as the Java LSP for VSCode, in headless configuration.
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