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Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income

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Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income

#151

Post by mindslight »

Negitivefrags wrote: post #112
zelon88 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In reality, what is more damaging for the environment? Replacing a 2019 Toyota Rav4 with a 2025 Tesla in North America, or..... Replacing a 1985 VW Jetta with a 2019 Toyota Rav4 in India? I see YouTube videos all the time where people in third world countries are using turn of the century hit-and-miss engines to power things like water pumps or machine tools. These countries are leaking countless gallons of oil and f…

Every car that is sold retires an old one. And the one it retires will be the least valuable. This happens becauase the person who buys a new car sells their old one to someone else, who sells their old one to someone else, and so on down the chain. The oldest cars from America go to other cheaper markets replacing the cars in use there.

> The oldest cars from America go to other cheaper markets replacing the cars in use there.

Why are you assuming other cars are being replaced? Those other markets are not at saturation. What is being replaced could very well be a bicycle.

Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income

#152

Post by mindslight »

ryandrake wrote: post #124
erulabs wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have to come into the article believing a ton of things: 1. Tax credits are illegitimate 2. Accelerated depreciation is illegitimate 3. Ownership of productive companies is "hoarding wealth" 4. Journalism is in a battle with the current administration 5. Paying taxes is a good thing If you _don't_ buy into these premises, for which there is no argument given for or against, you'll be tilted against the author. If…

How about simply the principle: 1. I should be able to deduct the same sorts of things from my individual income that corporations routinely deduct from their income. If a corporation can legally shield all of their income from taxes, why can't I shield all of my income from taxes? Corporations can deduct the costs of all the things they have to do to make money and do weird depreciation tricks, but I cannot deduct t…

This is one of the most galling things you realize when you start doing business taxes. If individuals were able to deduct expenses necessary to earn income like businesses do, that would include most meals, full cost of housing (not just mortgage interest), most utilities, vehicles [0], etc. And there would be no "standard deduction" to clear, either.

[0] official IRS policy is that "commuting" expenses are not deductible, but practically you declare the principal place of business as your home, and then anywhere else you go is no longer commuting.

Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income

#153

Post by iforgot22 »

TheGamerUncle wrote: post #34
lvl155 wrote: post #30

You know what’s ironic is that Tesla survived because of Obama era subsidies. They were desperate to get one private enterprise to succeed because so many solar and other “clean” energy private ventures failed during that period. So, in my view, Obama created Elon. Now the rest of America has to deal with it in addition to the abject failure that is PPACA which ballooned US healthcare costs (not that Republicans have…

Dang are we back to the years of the "Thanks Obama" I guess we truly live at the end of history and have no option but to rehash the classics, don't we ?

I'll stop "thanking" Obama for the ACA when health premiums go back to something sensible. But honestly I liked everything else about him.

Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income

#154

Post by iforgot22 »

casenmgreen wrote: post #3

I may be wrong, but I understand this is because the company invests all of its income into its business - which means more jobs, work for other companies, and so on. I think it better money goes into the economy, in a reasonably efficient way, rather than being taken by the State, and used in an unreasonably inefficient way.

Profit means it wasn't reinvested. May be later, or not.

Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income

#155

Post by Kirby64 »

boulos wrote: post #137
Kirby64 wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Does this actually happen? Absolutely it does. If you live near the Mexican border of the US, it’s extremely common to see older cars being towed headed south, presumably to Mexico. It’s not particularly expensive to drive them down to the border. > I bet the cars get trashed for scrap or parts. Only the least valuable and oldest ones that other countries don’t work. That means you’re overall moving up the modernne…

> presumably to Mexico. Also to Belize and other parts of Central and South America. They don't all stop in Mexico.

True enough. I suspect many aren’t going to South America since you can’t drive them there… but you can certainly drive all the way to Panama. If you want to head past Panama seems like it’d be easier to ship them directly from the US to their final destination.

Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income

#156

Post by icameron »

I’m still shocked that Tesla income is just 2.3B, compared to like, Meta who reports 62.3B net income. I didn’t realize how tiny Tesla is for the amount of media attention and stock valuation they have. Even amongst automakers they are tiny. Toyota had like 32B net income.

Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income

#157

Post by kemotep »

bmicraft wrote: post #134
kemotep wrote: post #73

A Single Tax regime aka the Land Value Tax would make these articles a thing of the past. We could solve the deficit, pay down our debts and many people would pay less in taxes, if we eliminated all taxes and replaced them with a Land Value Tax.

Sounds a lot like you want to drive "The Poors" out of the city, because that would be how you'd do it.

An average of 10,000 dollars per acre, when multi-family houses and apartments fit several families, if not dozens or hundreds into a single acre, aka how high density and efficient land use in cities work, they would pay little if nothing in a LVT and have no income tax. It’s people who have several acres in high value areas or hundreds of acres not being used for productive agriculture, the Rich, who would pay millions in taxes.

If an acre of land in New York City was 1 million dollars per year with a LVT, a high rise apartment with 100 units would have people paying 10,000 per year for their share. That would be a tax cut for many people.

Yes, grandma in the Bay Area in a massive McMansion on a fixed income would be displaced but that land use was inefficient and they were not paying their share of property taxes today under our current system anyway thanks to California property taxes.

Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income

#158

Post by TheAlchemist »

icameron wrote: post #156

I’m still shocked that Tesla income is just 2.3B, compared to like, Meta who reports 62.3B net income. I didn’t realize how tiny Tesla is for the amount of media attention and stock valuation they have. Even amongst automakers they are tiny. Toyota had like 32B net income.

You're in for quite a surprise if you thought Tesla is remotely comparable to other Big 7 companies.

Tesla is barely profitable at all, and if Trump ends EVs subsides Tesla will be severely bleeding money.

It's the quintesential meme stock.

Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income

#159

Post by shagmin »

ribosometronome wrote: post #144
Negitivefrags wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every car that is sold retires an old one. And the one it retires will be the least valuable. This happens becauase the person who buys a new car sells their old one to someone else, who sells their old one to someone else, and so on down the chain. The oldest cars from America go to other cheaper markets replacing the cars in use there.

>Every car that is sold retires an old one. I'm about to purchase my first car, a Tesla! Whose vehicle will be retired by my purchase?

Someone who has already bought their last car and it ends up sitting in a garage forever.

Re: Tesla Paid Zero Federal Income Tax in 2024, Despite $2.3B in Income

#160

Post by skissane »

ponty_rick wrote: post #118
Negitivefrags wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every car that is sold retires an old one. And the one it retires will be the least valuable. This happens becauase the person who buys a new car sells their old one to someone else, who sells their old one to someone else, and so on down the chain. The oldest cars from America go to other cheaper markets replacing the cars in use there.

I don't think anyone in India is buying old American cars

Especially since India drives on the left, and hence uses right-hand drive vehicles. American vehicles are almost all left-hand drive, which are illegal to drive in India – you'd either have to pay for an expensive conversion, or manage to get a rare legal exemption (reserved for historical vehicles, foreign diplomats and official visitors, and other such special cases) [0]

You can import used cars into India, but you'd generally be bringing them in from a left-hand drive market such as Japan, Australia or the UK. Plus, Indian law says import used cars have to be less than three years old, because India doesn't want to become a dumping ground for other countries old vehicles (which also undermines their local car manufacturing sector) [1]

[0] https://auto.hindustantimes.com/auto/cars/g20-summit-can-one...

[1] https://www.acko.com/car-guide/how-to-import-foreign-cars-to...

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