Going to leave this here https://blog.comma.ai/a-100x-investment-part-1/ https://blog.comma.ai/a-100x-investment-part-2/
yup, george also commented on the cruise news here https://x.com/realGeorgeHotz/status/1866617393436651688
GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house
151–160 of 692 posts
Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house
#152Earlier quoted context omitted.
The MB Drive Pilot only works at ridiculously low speeds (under 40 mph), on select highways, no sharp turns, no weather, no construction zones, lanes clearly visible, etc. It's laughable to compare it against FSD which works everywhere. FSD has been flawless when driving on such easy conditions for years.
FSD isn't driving though, you're driving. Mercedes is driving itself and you have 10 seconds to takeover. Huge difference between level 3 and level 2. One is self driving and one is just a drivers aid.
FSD is hybrid driving.
Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house
#153Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Small anecdote: I visited a GM dealership this week and the salesperson told me Super Cruise was not enabled for test drives. The excuse was pretty weak, like the dealership would have to pay for the service or something. GM might have the technology but they are completely bungling the strategy. That was a your-dealership issue, not a GM issue. GM doesn't run the dealerships (though they sure have plenty of influe…
That's a "GM's business model" problem, which is again a GM problem. The top-selling EV maker in the US doesn't have any dealerships, so clearly it's not an insurmountable problem. GM just hasn't prioritized surmounting it.
The top-selling EV maker in the US also has:
vehicles regularly catching on fire for no reason
vehicles driving into the back of emergency vehicles, slamming on the brakes in the middle of highways - both because the CEO decreed that RADAR/LIDAR isn't necessary
Issues with its "self driving" randomly swerving at objects, pedesrtians, cyclists, other vehicles...
Enormous service/parts/bodywork backlogs
vehicles blacklisted by insurance companies becaue of high crash rates and repair costs
windows that randomly shatter
drivetrains that fail because you drive them in too heavy a rainstorm
a truck that cannot be driven in the snow (snow reflects light off the DRL bar, blinding the driver, the headlights getting blocked by snow, and the vehicle is stymied by barely a few inches of snow):
https://www.tiktok.com/@molesrcool/video/7446853436198358303...
GM doesn't have any of these problems (except for a small number of Bolts which had defective cells made by LG - all replaced now, and given extended ten year warranties.)
Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house
#154Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's a "GM's business model" problem, which is again a GM problem. The top-selling EV maker in the US doesn't have any dealerships, so clearly it's not an insurmountable problem. GM just hasn't prioritized surmounting it.
To be fair to GM, Tesla basically had to be a brand new auto company and work through a whole bunch of legal loopholes and battles just to have their direct sales model. GM and the rest of the legacy automakers are essentially bound to the dealership system and the dealerships represent a much larger lobbying base than the automakers themselves. We are seeing this play out with VW’s attempt to direct-sell Scout vehic…
GM and the other automakers should be lobbying to change the dealership laws then.
Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house
#155> GM said in a statement that “... an increasingly competitive robotaxi market” were the reasons for the change. Isn't there basically Google/Waymo and then, seemingly much further behind, Tesla Cybertaxi, Amazon/Zoox, and Uber/Yandex? Cruise allegedly has one of the most sophisticated autonomous driving platforms, and GM's Super Cruise (if they share any tech) is comparable to Tesla FSD. Strange that they would bow…
> Isn't there basically Google/Waymo and then, seemingly much further behind Yes. I think GM leadership has finally learned enough to realize how far behind they are.
Maybe in some small parts of the country. Tesla is dominating most everywhere else in the US. I definitely have no access to a Waymo but have been driven by FSD in heavy construction. (Do not own a Tesla myself).
Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house
#156Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think it will be Tesla. Regulatory pressures for them just lifted, and they move faster than all the other driverless companies, courtesy of Elon's fairly hardcore mode of operation. It may not be a perfect driving solution (probably 1:1 teleoperator to car in the beginning), but their go to market speed is undeniably better than Waymo et al. Waymo, Cruise, etc have to map out an entire region and have long rollout…
Maybe I'm missing something but are there any current regulations that make it difficult to operate? My understanding was that in many states, it's mostly just paper requirements and not any strict testing, etc.
Nov 18 (Reuters) - Tesla (TSLA.O), opens new tab shares rose more than 5% on Monday after Bloomberg News reported that President-elect Donald Trump's transition team was planning to set up federal regulations for autonomous vehicles.
The report comes days after Trump named the automaker's CEO, Elon Musk, as a co-head of the incoming administration's government efficiency department. Trump's team is looking for policy leaders for the transport department to develop a federal regulatory framework, the report said, citing people familiar with the matter.
Last month, Musk criticized the state-by-state approval process, required for self-driving vehicles, as "incredibly painful", weeks after unveiling a two-seat "Cybercab" robotaxi without a steering wheel and foot pedals, set to go into production in 2026.
Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house
#157Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's a "GM's business model" problem, which is again a GM problem. The top-selling EV maker in the US doesn't have any dealerships, so clearly it's not an insurmountable problem. GM just hasn't prioritized surmounting it.
Business model enforced by the government.
And for good reason. The whole point of the regulation is to assure that there is someone nearby for the owner to get a vehicle repaired and be able to buy parts.
ahem Guess what Tesla has a ton of problems with?
Edit: there are a whole lot of people replying who seem unaware that I was referring to new car customers who have a vehicle which is broken under government-mandated warranties, but also that:
- The majority of manufacturers have long required proprietary diagnostic tools (the OBD-II functions in your car are only useful for the most basic diagnostic info, cannot adjust parameters, and cannot trigger diagnostic procedures such as cycling a valve or motor.) That is why some states and countries have right-to-repair laws. Automakers responded by shifting all that stuff to work only over telematics, and then claimed that online websites were not "tools."
- At one point car companies were doing bullshit like shipping parts with electronics in them "uncoded" (not uncommon, VAG does this) and not flashed with any firmware. Volvo did this. The firmware could only be flashed by a dealer, and it required them to plug the car into their internet-connected diagnostic tool through which servers in Sweden would encrypt the firmware for that specific VIN number and module, which could only be decrypted by the main control units in that specific car - and transmit it back to the technician's diagnostic tool.
- Teslas require software/online tools only provided to Tesla service centers and technicians
- You cannot buy parts for a Tesla without providing them with the VIN number of a car you own and which they still consider roadworthy. Tesla has a very arbitrary process for declaring vehicles to not be roadworthy, with relatively minor collisions triggering it, whereas vehicles nearly totally destroyed often are not declared unroadworthy and their VIN can be used to purchase parts
- Tesla does not distribute parts via third party distributors such as Worldpac, and prohibits its OEMs from selling parts, which is extremely unusual. You (and your independent mechanic) can only get parts directly from them - if they'll sell you the part at all.
The laws requiring dealerships and that they be independently owned were created because in the early days of the auto industry, people were getting endlessly screwed by automotive manufacturers producing cars that would break within weeks or months, did not have parts available for them at all, and the company would dissolve right after a production run so that customers had nobody to go after for damages.
The reason for requiring it be an independent business is simple; the state government wants to see that a local business has judged the manufacturer to have their shit together sufficiently enough to want to do business with them, and they won't be left holding the bag.
Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house
#158Earlier quoted context omitted.
Cruise and GM Supercruise/ultracruise share nothing except the names and a VP somewhere inside GM. Entirely separate organizations and tech, at least the last time I had any knowledge of the matter.
Yeah and neither of them is close to FSD in capabilities lol. Super Cruise/Ultra Cruise is a brittle highway-only thing, only available in a handful of $200k+ GM cars, that works by localizing to a detailed lidar map of some interstate routes.
This was also available on the Chevy Bolt EUV as an add-on for $2,200. The Bolt EUV started at $28,795, so with the add-on it could be had for ~$31k before tax, title, etc. Not sure where you got the $200k+ number.
Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house
#159Earlier quoted context omitted.
The MB Drive Pilot only works at ridiculously low speeds (under 40 mph), on select highways, no sharp turns, no weather, no construction zones, lanes clearly visible, etc. It's laughable to compare it against FSD which works everywhere. FSD has been flawless when driving on such easy conditions for years.
FSD isn't driving though, you're driving. Mercedes is driving itself and you have 10 seconds to takeover. Huge difference between level 3 and level 2. One is self driving and one is just a drivers aid.
> Mercedes is driving itself and you have 10 seconds to takeover. Huge difference between level 3 and level 2. One is self driving and one is just a drivers aid.
None of that is true, it just follows the car in front in slow moving traffic during daytime in good weather on premapped roads and cannot even change lanes. No car in front anymore? It completely fails to "self"-drive.
These limitations are taboo to talk about because the Mercedes system is used as an anti-Tesla talking point, you can get permanently banned from Reddit and BlueSky for bringing it up. Thats why so many people think its a great system.
Edit: Downvotes for bringing up inconvenient facts.
Re: GM exits robotaxi market, will bring Cruise operations in house
#160Earlier quoted context omitted.
It makes you wonder how much more effective U.S. auto makers might be without the regulation that requires them to sell through dealerships.
Isn't Tesla service worse than the dealerships? Maybe things have changed, my opinion is completely based on what I've read on the Internet.
No, there is a reason they are called stealerships.
A Subaru dealership tried to charge $200 to reset a passenger window like this (literally just pushing the button to roll down the window and back up):