Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Beekeepers halt honey awards over fraud in global supply chain

theguardian.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

151–160 of 241 posts

Re: Beekeepers halt honey awards over fraud in global supply chain

#151

Post by user3939382 »

Aurornis wrote: post #64
Michelangelo11 wrote: post #5

Feels like wherever you turn, you see a high-trust society disintegrating into a low-trust one.

Actually I think the opposite is true in many cases. Food quality and safety standards are higher than ever. This stuff sticks out because it’s getting caught and called out. There was a time when information spread slowly, tracking supply chains was basically impossible, and many businesses would do shady things because they knew they were unlikely to get caught. Now we can sample things like honey with lab equipmen…

To your point I’m reminded of the meat packing factories in The Jungle which were based on real conditions at that time and place.

Re: Beekeepers halt honey awards over fraud in global supply chain

#154

Post by oasisbob »

colechristensen wrote: post #112
jart wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it's not. Honey is defined by the USDA as being flower nectar that's been processed by bees[1]. Artificial honey can not be called honey[2]. If they're mixing it with high fructose corn syrup, then there should be a way to scientifically determine that. [1] https://www.ams.usda.gov/sites/default/files/media/Extracted... [2] https://www.ams.usda.gov/sites/default/files/media/Extracted...

A 90s percent of honey is fructose, glucose, and water. A very high 90s percent of corn syrup is fructose, glucose, and water. Getting the ratios the same is trivial. There is nothing magical about fructose or glucose from different sources, they’re exactly the same simple molecule. If you had very clean corn syrup, you could undetectably dilute honey and it would be quite the same. Lab tests being what they are thes…

Honey and sugar syrups have other various constituents, and it's trivially possible to tell them apart via GC/MS at far higher levels than ppb.

https://zenodo.org/records/438103

Re: Beekeepers halt honey awards over fraud in global supply chain

#155

Post by NelsonMinar »

jart wrote: post #79
Etheryte wrote: post #10

Here's a very straightforward guide to buying honey. If you see honey at a supermarket, no you don't, that's sugar syrup. If you see honey online, no you don't, that's sugar syrup. If you find an old dude with a small stand and a bunch of (most likely unlabelled) jars who only accepts cash, that's where you get real honey.

But all the honey labels say the only ingredient is honey. We've always been able to assume that with things like jams, or any other food, when manufacturers adulterate it with things like corn syrup, or even mild poisons, they proudly say so on the label. To not do so is fraud. How can people just claim that an entire industry is committing fraud??? Even this article doesn't mention anything about proof, just suspic…

The phrasing in the article about "suspected to be fraudulent" is over-cautious, probably because of Britain's very generous libel laws covering newspapers.

Re: Beekeepers halt honey awards over fraud in global supply chain

#156

Post by nativeit »

carbocation wrote: post #147
maltyr wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10346535/ Numerous studies have concluded that honey does have a better effect on health than the same amount of simple syrup, at least. > It has been demonstrated that honey consumption can influence plasma lipid, glucose, and insulin levels through different biochemical mechanisms. The decrease in blood glucose may be due to the fact that honey has a stimulatory effect on in…

An uncited statement in a review article! If I'm rich in time and money enough to routinely take the time to wander down to my friendly beekeeper and buy their small-batch artisanal honey, for so many reasons I will live longer than someone who isn't. Someone should randomize people to honey vs fake-honey-sugar-mix and settle the issue.

You mean, something like this?

> Forty-eight articles published in 42 different journals were analyzed, with a total of 3655 subjects with 29.51 ± 21.51 years of age, of whom 1990 consumed or were treated with honey. Of the 3655 subjects, at least 1803 were women (two studies did not specify). The studies included different population groups (healthy subjects, overweight or obese subjects, diabetic subjects, subjects with cancer, children, etc.) and included more than 30 different types of honey. Although it is not a systematic review, the results of the PEDro scale regarding the quality of the articles were in the range of 6–10, with articles scoring 6 or higher being considered of good methodological quality.

Re: Beekeepers halt honey awards over fraud in global supply chain

#157

Post by nativeit »

colechristensen wrote: post #112
jart wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it's not. Honey is defined by the USDA as being flower nectar that's been processed by bees[1]. Artificial honey can not be called honey[2]. If they're mixing it with high fructose corn syrup, then there should be a way to scientifically determine that. [1] https://www.ams.usda.gov/sites/default/files/media/Extracted... [2] https://www.ams.usda.gov/sites/default/files/media/Extracted...

A 90s percent of honey is fructose, glucose, and water. A very high 90s percent of corn syrup is fructose, glucose, and water. Getting the ratios the same is trivial. There is nothing magical about fructose or glucose from different sources, they’re exactly the same simple molecule. If you had very clean corn syrup, you could undetectably dilute honey and it would be quite the same. Lab tests being what they are thes…

We share more than 90% of our DNA with rats. I can’t speak for anyone else, but I’d like to suggest there are some qualitative differences between myself and a literal rat.

Re: Beekeepers halt honey awards over fraud in global supply chain

#158

Post by notyourwork »

spookie wrote: post #113
Snacklive wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Na dude, they are chill. They produce more under your friendship so you can keep a little. If they think the relationship is going toxic they just leave. It's awesome

Yeah, it's basically this. Most wouldn't survive winter.

How do they survive winter? Do they hibernate, go south or stay?

Re: Beekeepers halt honey awards over fraud in global supply chain

#159

Post by Anon_troll »

yumraj wrote: post #122
araneae wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you /really/ want to be sure, buy comb honey. Impossible to fake.

I've seen it but never dared to buy. What do you do with the honey comb, eat it? Does it taste waxy?

The comb walls are basically like chewing gum. It does not have much taste.

Re: Beekeepers halt honey awards over fraud in global supply chain

#160

Post by tucosan »

nativeit wrote: post #156
carbocation wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An uncited statement in a review article! If I'm rich in time and money enough to routinely take the time to wander down to my friendly beekeeper and buy their small-batch artisanal honey, for so many reasons I will live longer than someone who isn't. Someone should randomize people to honey vs fake-honey-sugar-mix and settle the issue.

You mean, something like this? > Forty-eight articles published in 42 different journals were analyzed, with a total of 3655 subjects with 29.51 ± 21.51 years of age, of whom 1990 consumed or were treated with honey. Of the 3655 subjects, at least 1803 were women (two studies did not specify). The studies included different population groups (healthy subjects, overweight or obese subjects, diabetic subjects, subjects…

How do they know the study participants consumed honey and not corn syrup?
Post reply on HN