Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The New Internet

tailscale.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

151–160 of 315 posts

Re: The New Internet

#151

Post by sulandor »

lockywolf wrote: post #106
viraptor wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Zerotier does kind of that. It's a tunnel, but also the traffic is direct (unless double Nat is involved) and if you could route the traffic directly to the endpoint IPs, you can skip zt. The location service can be self-hosted if you want. You don't have to use them as a service if you don't want to. Apart from dnssec it's pretty much what you're asking for.

Double NAT is now almost everywhere in the world, except maybe USA.

foreseeable yet still somewhat surprising that having a clean v4 address on the cpe has become a very privileged position.

just the other day i was discouraging a youngster from manually populating his hosts-file in order to circumvent a dmca-related dns block.... what has the world come to.

Re: The New Internet

#152

Post by sulandor »

teddyh wrote: post #145
sulandor wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The eternal problem with companies like it's not a problem specific to any kind of corporation or corporations per se, but organizations or even broader, solutions. though, do you really think that having a solution to a problem is worse than just having the problem?

It is a problem if a company makes a lot of money ”solving” the problem, but: • This does not really solve the problem, since a real solution would be to change the internet to make the problem go away • A company making a lot of money gets to have an enormous influence on what is considered reasonable to standardize on. See for instance Google’s and Microsoft’s influence on things like the W3C. (Or if Tailscale is a…

seems indeed that microsoft is making lots of money by defending the status quo

Re: The New Internet

#153

Post by jonathanlydall »

Speaking of Tailscale, does anyone know on Windows how to prevent it significantly slowing down file transfers between peer computers on my home LAN?

I don't really understand it, I can use the direct IP address of the other machine and I can still see tailscaled.exe using a lot of CPU and my file transfer being only 65MB/s. If I right click the system tray icon and exit from Tailscale, the transfer speed instantly jumps to 109MB/s (which is the maximum my Gb/s LAN).

Re: The New Internet

#155

Post by jonathanlydall »

jonathanlydall wrote: post #153

Speaking of Tailscale, does anyone know on Windows how to prevent it significantly slowing down file transfers between peer computers on my home LAN? I don't really understand it, I can use the direct IP address of the other machine and I can still see tailscaled.exe using a lot of CPU and my file transfer being only 65MB/s. If I right click the system tray icon and exit from Tailscale, the transfer speed instantly j…

Looks like it's due to this: https://github.com/tailscale/tailscale/issues/6999#issuecomm...

Re: The New Internet

#156

Post by heraldgeezer »

duggan wrote: post #79
locusofself wrote: post #2

I'm distracted by all the references to being "old" because the author remembers the 1990s.

Life moves pretty fast. I wouldn’t be too surprised if the median age of Tailscale’s audience was 24.

People born in 2000 use this?

What is it?

Can we call things for what they are? Is this a VPN? :)

Im tired and I am 34. So tired.

Re: The New Internet

#157

Post by p_l »

viraptor wrote: post #113
lockywolf wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Double NAT is now almost everywhere in the world, except maybe USA.

What kind of Nat though? You can use upnp, predictable mapping, etc. and still allow the traffic through. And that's only with ipv4, because you can run zerotier over IPv6.

You can't over double NAT because the second layer of NAT is not going to support UPnP

Re: The New Internet

#158

Post by Borg3 »

throw0101d wrote: post #146
Borg3 wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its not so easy. First, yeah I was operating networks, not maybe hyperscalers, but 200+ switches. Yes, ARP had a its problems, like ARP poisoning, but they are all sorted out already. IPv6 took its ND and bring a lot of other problems that we are solving AGAIN . Pure waste of time and effort. Also, please cut the crap about IoT and Hyper IP networks centrally managed. Thats just serveral huge corporations. Majority i…

> Its not so easy. First, yeah I was operating networks, not maybe hyperscalers, but 200+ switches. Yes, ARP had a its problems, like ARP poisoning, but they are all sorted out already. ARP poisoning is the least of ARP's problems. It can potentially have a blast radius that can bring down networks, and if it was actually sorted out, then things like BGP EVPN would not need to have been invented. One of touted benefi…

That is not ARP problem. Its called broadcast storm and its problem of stupid people and/or bad equipment. You can bring any network down with incompetence.

Thats why newer switches have STP, DHCP Snooping, ARP security and so on. Now take a look at ND tables exchaustion alone. Trival attack to do on IPv6 segment. Is it solved yet? I dont know. I do NOT track it.

The whole PnP (I call it Plug and Pray) is terrible aproach imo. IoT created hella of security problems (biggest DDoS botnets are IoT). If someone need autoconfiguration, he can slap DHCP on segment. Easy and super old protocol on IPv4. (IoT connected directly to internet? thats stupidy.. but I will leave that to other talk).

So, IPv6 should be simple, easy to implement and so less prone to mistakes. All extras should be put layer up.

Re: The New Internet

#159

Post by teddyh »

sulandor wrote: post #152
teddyh wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is a problem if a company makes a lot of money ”solving” the problem, but: • This does not really solve the problem, since a real solution would be to change the internet to make the problem go away • A company making a lot of money gets to have an enormous influence on what is considered reasonable to standardize on. See for instance Google’s and Microsoft’s influence on things like the W3C. (Or if Tailscale is a…

seems indeed that microsoft is making lots of money by defending the status quo

All large incumbents defend the status quo, except when advocating for larger barriers to entry for new and smaller competitors.

Re: The New Internet

#160

Post by teddyh »

tomjen3 wrote: post #149
teddyh wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Network- and location-based security is ultimately unworkable. It’s like if you, in order to work, had to go to a ”virtual office” to even send mail to your colleagues. Mail, and related internet-enabled services, should be accessible from anywhere , and be secured at the end points, not at the network layer. (Most attacks are internal, anyway.)

Why should you have access to the SSH host for my pie? Or, more to the point, the server that I use to run my RSS feed reader? Or my NAS? Tailscale makes these more secure and more accessible for me. They are never meant to have the world access them. Now for email and a few other things, sure, their nature is that they need to access the world.

> Why should you have access to the SSH host for my pie?

Because that is how the internet is meant to work. It is an end-to-end network. If SSH would not be secure enough to handle this, it would need a secure replacement.

> Or my NAS? […] They are never meant to have the world access them.

What is a NAS, if not a Network-Attached Storage, i.e. meant to be accessed from the network? The concept of a ”local”, ”secure” network is a dangerous illusion. Embrace ”zero trust” networking.

Post reply on HN