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WP21

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Re: WP21

#151

Post by paulryanrogers »

JeanMarcS wrote: post #109
ssalat wrote: post #25

Quick judgments and strong opinions have unfortunately become part of the community. Having spent the last 2-3 months working excessively on WordPress development, I would like to say a word about the excellent isolation of code with blocks ("Gutenberg"). As standalone plugins or in combination with Advanced Custom Fields, these allow for perfect, modular websites and development flows (design system), where even the…

WordPress is a great blogging CMS. The fact that people use it for something else is what create strong opinions. Example : woo commerce. Products ? In the WP_POST db. Orders ? In the WP_POST db. And in every post about WP it says that using WP_POST for storing your data is good practice. Well I don't think it is (but it's only my opinion. A strong one). And the problem is that a LOT of plugins and themes are like th…

Perhaps you mean 'table'?

Re: WP21

#152

Post by paulryanrogers »

Helmut10001 wrote: post #21
thisisjaymehta wrote: post #5

To be honest, I never found WordPress easy to use. It's all flowers and rainbows as long as I can find good themes and plugins. However, it starts going south as soon as I need to make a very small custom change.

Initial setup of wordpress is super easy, but it gets very hard to maintain after a while. Updates require manual intervention, themes must be fixed, plugins deprecate. All of this adds a burden I am not willing to accept, which is why I moved all my sites to Hugo/Jekyll/Mkdocs (etc.) since about 2017.

Automated updates are easier now, at least with well tested plugins and themes.

Re: WP21

#153

Post by gibrown »

croisillon wrote: post #103
NKosmatos wrote: post #50

I wish more companies would adopt the sabbatical policy that automattic has: https://automattic.com/benefits/sabbatical/

note that in the US they have 2 weeks vacations per year, so even with 3 months sabbatical less than in Europe

This isn't true at all. The vacation policy is "Our time off policy is short: take the time that you need" and "There is no minimum or maximum, but we encourage you to take at least 25 days of time off per year".

Re: WP21

#154

Post by n3storm »

blain wrote: post #142
deerfeeder wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I have to work with WP I always use the timber framework instead of the block/classic version https://timber.github.io/docs/v2/

I have worked with themes that used Timber and it has its own set of quirks. I also have an opinion that using things like Timber in WP themes just adds to the inconsistency instead of helping it. Taking over website with Timber when you never heard of it is fun. I don't want discourage, use what you like. Just my 2 cents.

Our choice for Timber is not about consistency, is about sanity and survival.

Re: WP21

#155

Post by atonse »

rob74 wrote: post #143

Do you know what makes you feel old? When you read "WP" and think not of WordPress (which would now apparently be accepted as an adult in even the most conservative countries), but of WordPerfect ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WordPerfect - which is now at "midlife crisis" age).

I still miss WordPerfect. I used to prefer it to MS Word. And it's been 25 years since I last used it.

Re: WP21

#156

Post by fastball »

sureIy wrote: post #125
fastball wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It really depends on your needs. Are there many alternatives more flexible than WP? No. But that is begging the question. The vast majority of people don't need the kitchen sink that is WP, and would be better served by utilizing one of the many products and platforms that have cropped up to fill more specific niches since the inception of WP. Just need a blog? Maybe want it to be a newsletter? Ghost, Medium, Substac…

Out of all your examples, only Ghost is self hosted. Not everyone wants to or is able to afford a $20/month provider, especially small businesses outside the US.

Given that your previous comment said "can be jump started by anyone", self-hosted is definitely not a reasonable requirement.

Self-hosted WP cannot be jump started by anyone, and in the limited cases it can (very, very limited WP), you're probably not spending much less than $20/m.

Re: WP21

#157

Post by joshbetz »

Pikamander2 wrote: post #105

WordPress is simultaneously amazing and terrible. At its best, it's a highly extensible free and open source CMS that's incredibly easy to set up and customize. For that matter, its core has reasonably good security and performance before third-party themes and plugins are added into the mix. The problem comes in with how many basic GUI-based features it's still missing out of the box 21 years later. Take, for exampl…

> Take, for example, the curious case of the lack of post cloning

The percentage of users that need this functionality is exceptionally low. If WordPress bundled every feature that some percentage of users could ever need, we'd have the opposite problem. The GUI would be an endless mishmash of features that most people don't need.

> There's a 99% chance that site is running WordPress and has dozens of plugins and got hacked at some point

I don't know about these statistics, but I take your point. Although I'm not so sure this is as big a problem in recent years. The WordPress team has made big improvements in improving the quality of the WordPress plugin repository.

The reality is that WordPress is a big target. Even if they included all the features from the top 1000 plugins (which would cause an uproar), there would still be a huge market for plugins and some of those plugins would have security vulnerabilities.

Re: WP21

#158

Post by Helmut10001 »

paulryanrogers wrote: post #152
Helmut10001 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Initial setup of wordpress is super easy, but it gets very hard to maintain after a while. Updates require manual intervention, themes must be fixed, plugins deprecate. All of this adds a burden I am not willing to accept, which is why I moved all my sites to Hugo/Jekyll/Mkdocs (etc.) since about 2017.

Automated updates are easier now, at least with well tested plugins and themes.

How about PHP updates for major versions (e.g. 7 to 8), or how about maintainability for 10+ years? I was sick of all the work that emerged after a while for some simple sites. I have about 15 websites, all focus on a specific topic, with one or two updates per year. Wordpress is too much for this. Static sites can be moved around or hosted on the most basic nginx, whereas Wordpress requires a lot more.

I am not against wordpress in general, just that I found it not suited for my purposes.

Re: WP21

#159

Post by throw5345346 »

henning wrote: post #10

WordPress is proof that clean code doesn't matter. Security doesn't matter. Out of the box performance doesn't matter. At least none of these matter if you are the 800 lb gorilla in the market and everyone else is trying to take a piece out of you.

> WordPress is proof that clean code doesn't matter.

At least it isn't Magento.

Re: WP21

#160

Post by throw5345346 »

joshbetz wrote: post #157
Pikamander2 wrote: post #105

WordPress is simultaneously amazing and terrible. At its best, it's a highly extensible free and open source CMS that's incredibly easy to set up and customize. For that matter, its core has reasonably good security and performance before third-party themes and plugins are added into the mix. The problem comes in with how many basic GUI-based features it's still missing out of the box 21 years later. Take, for exampl…

> Take, for example, the curious case of the lack of post cloning The percentage of users that need this functionality is exceptionally low. If WordPress bundled every feature that some percentage of users could ever need, we'd have the opposite problem. The GUI would be an endless mishmash of features that most people don't need. > There's a 99% chance that site is running WordPress and has dozens of plugins and got…

> The percentage of users that need this functionality is exceptionally low.

I am not sure about this -- I do know users who rely on post-cloning to update their sites. And I don't think it's unreasonable that this functionality should be fore.

But what I would say is, it's not a slam-dunk as a piece of generalised functionality, though it might be possible to implement it fairly completely for the core post types.

It would almost certainly need new core hooks. There are questions for example about who can clone whose posts -- do the editing and ownership mechanisms need updating, etc. And it might need reassessing in the Gutenberg era.

I've found post cloning plugins to be an adequate solution here.

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