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U.S. sues Apple, accusing it of maintaining an iPhone monopoly

nytimes.com

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Re: U.S. sues Apple, accusing it of maintaining an iPhone monopoly

#151

Post by basisword »

amelius wrote: post #131
gnicholas wrote: post #13

> The Justice Department, which began its investigation into Apple in 2019, chose to build a broader and more ambitious case than any other regulator has brought against the company. As I was reading the specific charges detailed in the article, I was thinking this case seems like a stretch and will be difficult to prove. Apple will argue that security and/or performance reasons drove their decisions related to brows…

> Apple will argue that security and/or performance reasons drove their decisions related to browser choice, messaging, and Apple wallet Then why, for the sake of the argument, do they allow third party browsers, messaging and payments on MacOS ?!? Apple makes it sound like MacOS is horribly insecure.

Legacy decision? Would they do the same starting a new desktop OS today? Much more high risk personal data on an iPhone (e.g. health data, biometrics) requiring stricter security? Many more sensors which could be abused by nefarious actors on iOS (GPS, lots of mics, lidar, cameras, etc) and these are always with us?

Re: U.S. sues Apple, accusing it of maintaining an iPhone monopoly

#152

Post by AlanYx »

ianlevesque wrote: post #115
retskrad wrote: post #62

I've heard all arguments against Apple's practices, and to me, they all basically come down to 'it's unfair that so many people like to live inside the Apple walled garden'. When it comes to the law, Apple is not a monopoly. When it comes to competition on the market, Apple is competing with Android and Windows, and the vast majority of the world's middle and upper class willingly choose Apple products. Even if you l…

I like my iPhone, and want to be able to use Kagi as my search engine. Why can't I?

That seems like something they'd be willing to fix. They allow users to select Ecosia, an extremely niche search engine. Kagi should be on that list too.

Re: U.S. sues Apple, accusing it of maintaining an iPhone monopoly

#153

Post by overstay8930 »

Pfhortune wrote: post #54
lokar wrote: post #18

As an iPhone user I am willing (and believe I am) paying Apple a premium for a well curated and reviewed App Store (vs android). I just wish they would stop “double dipping “ and charging far in excess of their costs (and in excess of reasonable profit) to the app sellers.

> I am willing (and believe I am) paying Apple a premium for a well curated and reviewed App Store (vs android) There is a plethora of evidence that this is not the case. See this recent example: https://techcrunch.com/2024/02/08/a-fake-app-masquerading-as... (Yes, it was pulled, but that was _after_ the public noticed and LastPass had to issue a warning) > I just wish they would stop “double dipping “ and charging f…

> There is a plethora of evidence that this is not the case.

Do you have actual evidence for this claim? Because it's pretty widely accepted that the App Store has higher standards and quality, and you just cited a single case.

Re: U.S. sues Apple, accusing it of maintaining an iPhone monopoly

#155

Post by tarsinge »

generj wrote: post #110

I think it’s interesting this is one of the first large anti-tech anti-trust lawsuits that has actually materialized since the FTC/DOJ signaled interest in going after these giants. Perhaps the case is less complex and this could be brought earlier? Or there were some really damning things in discovery proving other justifications Apple has (security, performance, etc) are secondary to punishing competitors products.…

The Google monopoly seems way worst and straightforward to me. Why it isn’t addressed first and why does everyone seemingly ignore them and obsess with Apple is a mystery to me.

Re: U.S. sues Apple, accusing it of maintaining an iPhone monopoly

#156

Post by screamingninja »

flenserboy wrote: post #69

The government does not want people to have secure devices. Whether or not Apple's are currently secure is not the point; that they are working to make them so is enough to make sure it doesn't happen.

On the contrary, secure computational infrastructure furthers national security. US happens to have a very large footprint of vulnerable infrastructure as compared to other nations that tightly regulate their Internet. Believe it or not, more secure devices are actually good for the US. There have been several articles and discussions around it and the government has been working closely with the industry for years to improve the security posture.

Re: U.S. sues Apple, accusing it of maintaining an iPhone monopoly

#157

Post by kmeisthax »

hbn wrote: post #61

If Apple's iPhone "monopoly" is illegal then sue Google for continuing to make Android worse. That's why I switched to iPhone and have no desire to switch back. Apple's crime here is they made a good product and continued to iterate on it, while Google has churned for years, reinventing and rebranding every app, service, and product multiple times a year and only making them worse so POs can get promotions.

I mean, you're not wrong, but the lawsuit isn't about the quality of the end product. It's about the economic leverage Apple has over other businesses by virtue of owning the chokepoints - i.e. the OS software and the signing keys it trusts.

I personally would love to switch to iPhone if Apple wasn't so much of a control freak about the software you run on it.

Re: U.S. sues Apple, accusing it of maintaining an iPhone monopoly

#158

Post by nottorp »

Nifty3929 wrote: post #44

Apple has about 60% of the smartphone market in the US, and about 25% globally. That's a pretty big stretch to call it a monopoly. There are many non-apple phone options that many consumers easily avail themselves of. And at least one other OS choice as well. All of these are fully supported by the entire ecosystem of telcos. Seems like bullying to score political points to me.

> There are many non-apple phone options

One non-apple phone option. Or you're somehow deluded into thinking the hardware matters any more?

Re: U.S. sues Apple, accusing it of maintaining an iPhone monopoly

#159

Post by airstrike »

bilekas wrote: post #126

I know its a small thing, but isn't the phrase "an iPhone monopoly" a bit redundant ? I surely can't say shame on Mars for having a "A CocaCola monopoly" ? From established writers at NYT, I suspect I am wrong, but it seems a weird expression.

From established writers who are, perhaps, first solving for clicks rather than accuracy or journalistic integrity.
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