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Google: Angular and Wiz Are Merging

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Re: Google: Angular and Wiz Are Merging

#151

Post by troupo »

pohuing wrote: post #137
miiiiiike wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly my point. I linked to the reference docs, you linked to the usage docs. They're completely divorced from each other. There's not even a link from reference to usage docs. For the reference docs to be useful you already have to know what the thing is, what it does, why you'd need it. You can be on the component page where `viewProviders` is documented and get nothing from it if you're coming in fresh. Why woul…

Which is strange. Google knows how to write docs. Or at least I've been very happy with the flutter docs. But now working on angular frontend is awful tooling wise. I don't even get useful inline docs for a lot of libraries.

> Which is strange. Google knows how to write docs.

Oh, they don't. Some of their teams know how to write docs for some of the products. A lot of the time it's autogenerated reference with a couple of bare-bones examples

Re: Google: Angular and Wiz Are Merging

#152

Post by ceving »

bheadmaster wrote: post #65
twelfthnight wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hear "revolutionary" claimed about languages like Rust, Haskell and Zig, but rarely about Go. What about Golang is revolutionary to you?

There are several features that can be considered neat on their own. Most of those features are probably derived from other languages, but together they form a very powerful language that simply takes away the pain that I feel using other modern languages, such as C++, Python, Java and NodeJS. Here are a few on top of my head: 1) CSP concepts embedded deeply into the language (goroutines/channels/select) making concu…

Topics where Go has failed:

  - No tail call optimization
  - No meta-programming
Both do exist in Scheme since 1975.

Re: Google: Angular and Wiz Are Merging

#153

Post by nebula8804 »

troupo wrote: post #149
esprehn wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google uses Angular quite a lot already. Pretty much all internal tools (bug tracker, code review, release tooling etc) is built with it. There's also a number of public facing apps like GCP Cloud Console and the Gemini web app. Wiz has historically favored performance over ergonomics in the extreme. None of it is open source, and to be honest even if it was it's unlikely most people would want to use the mix of Java…

> Wiz has historically favored performance over ergonomics in the extreme. This unsubstantiated claim is being paraded around by Googlers all over Twitter. And there's literaly nothing to back up this claim. Have you seen the extreme performance of the websites it apparently powers? Here's Youtube's extreme performance: https://twitter.com/dmitriid/status/1770911027766370648

That thread was amazing to follow. I got a chuckle at the end. These engineers are responsible for the fates of a lot of people outside of Google as well because of how many companies have adopted their tooling (like my company). They should be challenged to defend their views in the real world. If they are good ideas then it shouldn't be a problem.

Re: Google: Angular and Wiz Are Merging

#154

Post by baggachipz »

wentin wrote: post #134
baggachipz wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We just got done porting everything from AngularJS to Angular D:

A joke or really? At this point, I would just port it into Svelte, it is the same amount of effort anyway and it has been so long!

We started the transition years ago; large codebase to port. Trust me, if it was my choice it wouldn't be Angular. I trust no google product.

Re: Google: Angular and Wiz Are Merging

#155

Post by mgechev »

wentin wrote: post #132
mgechev wrote: post #98

Hey everyone, I'm working on this at Google and would be happy to answer your questions :) The tldr; is that we see a lot of similar requirements from developers across Angular and Wiz, so we're looking for opportunities to reuse work. Good example is the Angular Signals library that's now used in all the YouTube Mobile Web. In a similar way, Angular is bringing more fine-grained code loading that Wiz offers. Over ti…

> The tldr; is that we see a lot of similar requirements from developers across Angular and Wiz, so we're looking for opportunities to reuse work. Good example is the Angular Signals library that's now used in all the YouTube Mobile Web. In a similar way, Angular is bringing more fine-grained code loading that Wiz offers. It sounds no different from Svelte borrowing concepts from SolidJS, or Vue borrowing ideas from…

Merging is the ultimate goal! Both teams are already working closely together on shared designs and specific implementations.

Re: Google: Angular and Wiz Are Merging

#156

Post by mgechev »

johny_morte wrote: post #135
mgechev wrote: post #98

Hey everyone, I'm working on this at Google and would be happy to answer your questions :) The tldr; is that we see a lot of similar requirements from developers across Angular and Wiz, so we're looking for opportunities to reuse work. Good example is the Angular Signals library that's now used in all the YouTube Mobile Web. In a similar way, Angular is bringing more fine-grained code loading that Wiz offers. Over ti…

Hey, im working with angular for almost 5 years now.. What changes should we -developers - expect in the developer experience. In other words how we work with angular. Are you aiming for the "drop-in" replacement same as with ivy back then? Or new standards are comming with this? Thx!

At this point, we are not anticipating to have to develop a new rendering engine at this point, so it should be a more incremental effort than Ivy.

As an Angular developer you could expect new features and developer experience improvements. Also over time you’d see more of Angular used in popular consumer Google products.

Re: Google: Angular and Wiz Are Merging

#157

Post by mgechev »

troupo wrote: post #146
mgechev wrote: post #98

Hey everyone, I'm working on this at Google and would be happy to answer your questions :) The tldr; is that we see a lot of similar requirements from developers across Angular and Wiz, so we're looking for opportunities to reuse work. Good example is the Angular Signals library that's now used in all the YouTube Mobile Web. In a similar way, Angular is bringing more fine-grained code loading that Wiz offers. Over ti…

What are specific "innovative approaches to perfromance" is wiz bringing? Even though it's claimed that it powers many of Google's websites, most of those websites are very far from being paragons of performance.

It introduced very fine-grained code loading on interaction and something the community refers to as resumability.

Re: Google: Angular and Wiz Are Merging

#158

Post by mgechev »

Drac707 wrote: post #138
mgechev wrote: post #98

Hey everyone, I'm working on this at Google and would be happy to answer your questions :) The tldr; is that we see a lot of similar requirements from developers across Angular and Wiz, so we're looking for opportunities to reuse work. Good example is the Angular Signals library that's now used in all the YouTube Mobile Web. In a similar way, Angular is bringing more fine-grained code loading that Wiz offers. Over ti…

is wiz gonna get open source now that is getting merged?

Yes, via Angular.

Re: Google: Angular and Wiz Are Merging

#159

Post by troupo »

mgechev wrote: post #157
troupo wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are specific "innovative approaches to perfromance" is wiz bringing? Even though it's claimed that it powers many of Google's websites, most of those websites are very far from being paragons of performance.

It introduced very fine-grained code loading on interaction and something the community refers to as resumability.

Could be interesting/useful, but none of these seem to have any impact on the sites like Youtube which loads tens of megabytes of resources, and every interaction takes a second or so to happen.

Other sites like Photos are fast and performant, but I wonder if it's due to whatever perceived advantages of Wiz or due to the team actually caring: https://medium.com/google-design/google-photos-45b714dfbed1

Edit: replaced incorrect link with a correct one

Re: Google: Angular and Wiz Are Merging

#160

Post by twelfthnight »

agotterer wrote: post #77
twelfthnight wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What choice can you point to that has increased Google's market cap? Google's search quality is deteriorating, Waymo is yet to make a profit, GCP is struggling, "Attention is all you need" was too early on to credit Sundar, and since then Google's reputation is flagging due to embarrassing AI models... I think Google's market cap is increase _despite_ Sundar, not because. That said, Google does have enough resources…

GCP is struggling? Is that an opinion based on experience or based on actual stats? Because GCP revenue has increased every year since 2017. AWS and Azure are capturing more market share. But I’m not sure I consider third place and $33B in revenue last year a struggle.[1] > I just don't think Sundar is the right person to do it That was sort of my point. Does Google need to be turned around? All stock metrics and rev…

Google Cloud Platform's growth is slowing [1]. It's finally profitable, but I don't think distant third place is what Google was looking for after 10 years of pouring billions of losses into it.

At the time of this news, Google's stock fell 5 percent, so it is hurting company evaluation, at least temporarily.

Google's stock might be rising, but what is causing that? I can't point to any material success of Google in the last 10 years to explain it, seems to me Google is coasting.

https://www.reuters.com/technology/google-parent-alphabet-re...

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