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macOS Sonoma 14.4 might break Java on your machine

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Re: macOS Sonoma 14.4 might break Java on your machine

#151

Post by grodriguez100 »

unilynx wrote: post #145
galad87 wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mostly, but JIT is not allowed in the App Store apps, so probably this change didn't broke anything over there.

But it will soon be once the EU DMA changes require support for alternative browser engines. Was this change an attempt to lock down too wide permissions a JIT might set up and perhaps really intended for iOS instead of macOS?

I don't think the EU DMA changes will require that JIT is supported. Supporting alternative browser engines is something that can be done perfectly without JIT.

Re: macOS Sonoma 14.4 might break Java on your machine

#152

Post by blackoil »

vbezhenar wrote: post #111
addicted wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reputation was well earned when Linux on the Desktop wasn’t as easy or friendly as it is today and was severely lacking good quality GUI applications. Windows was a virus laden mess and was not useful for running Linux apps. And besides the flaws of the other OS’es, OS X had some of the nicest window management features (Expose from the Snow Leopard is still my favorite window switcher), was a UNIX and had a thri…

Here are few particular things that I like about development in my mac: 1. Terminal is very usable, compared to Windows cmd. Modern Gnome Terminal is good, though. 2. Cmnd+C for copy, Ctrl+C for SIGINT. 3. Touch ID instead of root password, which works with Bluetooth keyboard as well, and that's with absolutely minimal configuration, uncommenting single line.

1. Default is now Windows Terminal which is so much better than Cmd and Mac Terminal.

2. Ctrl+C works for copy when text is selected otherwise SIGINT.

Re: macOS Sonoma 14.4 might break Java on your machine

#153

Post by SpaghettiCthulu »

blackoil wrote: post #152
vbezhenar wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here are few particular things that I like about development in my mac: 1. Terminal is very usable, compared to Windows cmd. Modern Gnome Terminal is good, though. 2. Cmnd+C for copy, Ctrl+C for SIGINT. 3. Touch ID instead of root password, which works with Bluetooth keyboard as well, and that's with absolutely minimal configuration, uncommenting single line.

1. Default is now Windows Terminal which is so much better than Cmd and Mac Terminal. 2. Ctrl+C works for copy when text is selected otherwise SIGINT.

But both are awful compared to the other terminal emulators available. My favourites are alacritty and kitty.

Re: macOS Sonoma 14.4 might break Java on your machine

#154

Post by self_awareness »

benterix wrote: post #143
vbezhenar wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here are few particular things that I like about development in my mac: 1. Terminal is very usable, compared to Windows cmd. Modern Gnome Terminal is good, though. 2. Cmnd+C for copy, Ctrl+C for SIGINT. 3. Touch ID instead of root password, which works with Bluetooth keyboard as well, and that's with absolutely minimal configuration, uncommenting single line.

> Terminal is very usable, compared to Windows cmd. It is subpar, however, when compared to Windows Terminal.

Which is probably subpar comparing to Linux terminals and macOS iTerm2?

Re: macOS Sonoma 14.4 might break Java on your machine

#155

Post by lwkl »

fphhotchips wrote: post #109
nottorp wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just set up a windows box for some development last week. Spent 2-3 hours per day on it (on work not setup). So far I haven't managed to turn off the firewall scare popups, I did manage to remove that crap in the task bar that pops up the weather and selected news covering half the screen if you hover in the wrong place, I may or may not have turned off the OneDrive upsell, and I also got a full screen message to u…

Let's not pretend that Mac OS is immune to a bit of the old upsell too. Core OS that features only work when paired with iPad/iPhone. iCloud is actively difficult not to use. The sidebar with the Apple shares and news apps.

> Let's not pretend that Mac OS is immune to a bit of the old upsell too.

Of course but Microsoft is way more obnoxious about it. In macOS (and iOS) the upsell is a small icon in your system settings. On Windows it's big notifications when you start up your devices. Links in your start menu to third party apps. Notifications when you install and run third-party browsers.

Most mac apps work without an Apple ID. On Windows you can't even use the built in video editor (Clipchamp) without logging in to a Microsoft account.

Microsoft just sucks at UX. On Windows 11 a lot of people now have three versions of Microsoft teams installed. Teams Classic, Teams New, and Teams personal edition. And the search makes sure to avoid showing you the one you use most as the default result.

Don't get me started on how many nag screens and cookie warnings you have to go through when you start Microsoft Edge. I use both Windows and macOS regularly (macOS is my daily driver right now) and Windows has the way worse user experience.

Re: macOS Sonoma 14.4 might break Java on your machine

#156

Post by self_awareness »

addicted wrote: post #93
baq wrote: post #28

Been saying this for as long as I’ve been using macOS: it is not a developer friendly OS and am close to the conclusion that this reputation is a psy-op. Yeah it’s pretty, it mostly works when the box is first turned on and the hardware is unmatched but macOS itself is actually subpar. QA seems second tier, things you’d except from other OSes like, I don’t know, using a third party second display are just bad experie…

The reputation was well earned when Linux on the Desktop wasn’t as easy or friendly as it is today and was severely lacking good quality GUI applications. Windows was a virus laden mess and was not useful for running Linux apps. And besides the flaws of the other OS’es, OS X had some of the nicest window management features (Expose from the Snow Leopard is still my favorite window switcher), was a UNIX and had a thri…

> And besides the flaws of the other OS’es, OS X had some of the nicest window management features

I'm always confused by such statements, because what KDE offers on Linux easily dwarfs every window management concept in every major OS. I always need to install additional third-party apps (e.g. Rectangle on macOS) to get a poor-man's equivalent of KDE-style window management functionality.

Re: macOS Sonoma 14.4 might break Java on your machine

#157

Post by dahauns »

grodriguez100 wrote: post #151
unilynx wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it will soon be once the EU DMA changes require support for alternative browser engines. Was this change an attempt to lock down too wide permissions a JIT might set up and perhaps really intended for iOS instead of macOS?

I don't think the EU DMA changes will require that JIT is supported. Supporting alternative browser engines is something that can be done perfectly without JIT.

>Supporting alternative browser engines is something that can be done perfectly without JIT.

Unless I missed something and the DMA requirement is along the lines of "having to allow other browser engines as long as they don't bring their own JITting Javascript engine", no, it literally can't.

Re: macOS Sonoma 14.4 might break Java on your machine

#158

Post by ggpsv »

SpaghettiCthulu wrote: post #153
blackoil wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. Default is now Windows Terminal which is so much better than Cmd and Mac Terminal. 2. Ctrl+C works for copy when text is selected otherwise SIGINT.

But both are awful compared to the other terminal emulators available. My favourites are alacritty and kitty.

I use Alacritty in Windows with WSL2/Ubuntu. Works without troubles.

Re: macOS Sonoma 14.4 might break Java on your machine

#159

Post by renonce »

grodriguez100 wrote: post #151
unilynx wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it will soon be once the EU DMA changes require support for alternative browser engines. Was this change an attempt to lock down too wide permissions a JIT might set up and perhaps really intended for iOS instead of macOS?

I don't think the EU DMA changes will require that JIT is supported. Supporting alternative browser engines is something that can be done perfectly without JIT.

Depends on whether Apple’s own browser engine requires JIT. I think the point is to ensure fair competition.

Re: macOS Sonoma 14.4 might break Java on your machine

#160

Post by ggpsv »

self_awareness wrote: post #154
benterix wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Terminal is very usable, compared to Windows cmd. It is subpar, however, when compared to Windows Terminal.

Which is probably subpar comparing to Linux terminals and macOS iTerm2?

Having used iTerm2 and macOS for a long time, Alacritty in Windows with WSL2 and a Linux distro is a much better experience.
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