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Working in the Vision Pro [video]

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Re: Working in the Vision Pro [video]

#151

Post by lexlash »

Eugr wrote: post #124
lexlash wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes and no. In order to get and maintain the best possible clarity, key for text, I have to wear it higher on my face than is comfortable and tighten the strap more than I would prefer. If I could wear it a little lower or with different supports on my face I could easily spend a full day in it; as it is, I’ve yet to spend more than 4h with it on. I find the Meta Quest Pro and 3 more comfortable, but the CV1 was the…

I have an Xreal Air and don't find it comfortable at all unless I'm laying down. I have to use optical inserts, and it just keeps sliding down my nose all the time. Quest 3 is vastly more comfortable for me, especially with the Elite strap. Quest Pro, on the other hand, wasn't as comfortable due to the pressure to the forehead... I'll get my AVP later today, will compare then.

Got LASIK in order to do research on stuff like this. I hated jamming my glasses in between my face and CV1; I can’t imagine the xreal working well with inserts - I have to keep it very close to my face in order for it to function.

Re: Working in the Vision Pro [video]

#152

Post by dkonofalski »

criddell wrote: post #118
swozey wrote: post #111

Are these in every apple store to demo or are they so low volume they're all for sale?

Demoing is hard because of the vision prescription (if needed) and the face scan required to get the light seals right. These things aren’t really designed for sharing. But you can buy one and if it isn’t what you hoped for, you can return it within 14 days. In my experience, returns at Apple are quick and easy.

Apple has the prescription lenses in the stores. If you bring your glasses, they have a device that will shine some lights through your glasses to determine your prescription and pop out the correct lenses needed for the Vision demo.

Re: Working in the Vision Pro [video]

#153

Post by makeitdouble »

uicompat wrote: post #65

This was a great demo, and the spatial computing stuff is cool, but what? He’s showing off that he has a big screen tv playing a video, overlayed over his big screen tv, playing a video without anyone watching it. He shows video playing cooking tutorials in his kitchen when he and his partner are both in other rooms working at their desks. A “note” pinned to his fridge, that he can only see while wearing the headset.…

> I’m confused by the enthusiasm. Have we all forgot that we’ve been through this “virtual desktop” cycle already?

A lot of people wouldn't touch a Meta headset with a ten foot pole, especially with all the account shitshow that happened when the Occulus brand got sunsetted. Then Vive headsets required a lot more investment and you had to be already convinced to dive into it. Not mentionning that macs and the all Apple ecosystem didn't have enough GPU power to deal with VR so anyone knee deep in there wouldn't touch VR.

I'm kinda glad that side of the market gets into VR, and even if we see a lot of tired ideas in a "eternal September" style, we might get new insights and nice findings as well along the way.

I'd still be worried about how much Apple will allow for users to tweak that experience. I don't see a third party window manager being ever allowed for instance

Re: Working in the Vision Pro [video]

#154

Post by Ancapistani »

sureglymop wrote: post #148
Ancapistani wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is no window management whatsoever. FYI, Immersed is planning on releasing their app for visionOS. According to their employees on Discord, they're expecting that to happen around the end of February. Immersed is by far the best "virtual desktop" app I've ever used, so I expect it will solve most or all of the issues with Apple's implementation at launch. I'm guessing Apple will catch up eventually, but for n…

Isn't Immersed actually going into hardware and also trying to launch their own VR headset now?

Yeah, they have the “Visor”.

Re: Working in the Vision Pro [video]

#155

Post by jwells89 »

turtlebits wrote: post #79
xnx wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. You can only focus your attention on a limited area regardless of number of screens. A head-turn is a worse interface for switching information than a shortcut key.

Everyone works differently. I use several monitors at work and definitely have to turn my head a few degrees to focus on my secondary. I use an ultrawide at home. I'm way more productive with more display area than a single display using virtual workspaces and shortcut keys.

Similarly I do better with multiple monitors and infrequent app/workspace switching than I do with one monitor switching apps/workspaces constantly.

In fact one of the reasons my gaming PC doesn’t often do double duty as a Linux workstation is because it only has a single monitor and no matter how I configure shortcuts for switching apps and workspaces, I always find myself irritated to the point of distraction trying to get work done. All my real work happens on my dual monitor Mac setup.

Re: Working in the Vision Pro [video]

#156

Post by makeitdouble »

wnevets wrote: post #26

This is starting to me remind of when everyone was talking about replacing their Desktop/Laptop with an iPad and a Bluetooth keyboard for their work machine. I don't know anyone who was able to do so successfully.

The iPad ? no. A Surface Pro or a Z13 ? totally. Even chromebooks are covering all the computing needs of many people.

The tablet/convertible form factor is I think here to stay, even if it doesn't dethrone the standard laptop.

To your point, I'd see the same curve for the AVP: it will never become a super solid standalone device, Apple won't let other companies meddle with their vision. But Microsoft, Meta, Vive or Asus will eventually push their headsets over the line, and it won't be the default computing choice for most people, but will still be a solid choice for anyone willing to invest in the experience and take the tradeoffs.

Re: Working in the Vision Pro [video]

#157

Post by makeitdouble »

snakeyjake wrote: post #134
wnevets wrote: post #26

This is starting to me remind of when everyone was talking about replacing their Desktop/Laptop with an iPad and a Bluetooth keyboard for their work machine. I don't know anyone who was able to do so successfully.

Unless your definition of "work" is limited to "programming locally" there are millions of people who have replaced their laptop with an iPad. There are millions more who use it as a content creation tool, despite HN users' insistence of that impossibility. One of my favorite youtubers (1M subscribers) produces his video content on and runs his channel from an iPad.

I think parent's point is these people probably still kept a laptop on the side, even if that's not their primary device.

And it's totally fine, but we could be at a point where there was absolutely no need to keep a laptop "just in case" or for the rare occasions it's needed.

I like the Connected podcast's take on it, where at some point two of the three hosts where primarily on iPad, but keeping their recording setup on the mac and a few other task where they needed another computer as a bridge for random reasons.

Re: Working in the Vision Pro [video]

#158

Post by lttlrck »

As a user of i3 and more recently sway for years now, there is no way I could adapt to this. I'd take a huge efficiency hit.

Turning my head is for looking out the window or talking to colleagues/family...

Re: Working in the Vision Pro [video]

#159

Post by mil22 »

mil22 wrote: post #73
mewpmewp2 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand. I don't even have to technically turn head with 3 screens. It's just eyes I have to move, and even if I turned head, it's barely 20 degrees? I have 3 screens, but honestly would prefer more. I find it more uncomfortable to eyes to switch screens on the same window, especially if one is light and the other is dark. The blinking is disorientating and can be eye hurting, because eye is not prepared f…

I think it very much depends on the viewing distance. Using https://qasimk.io/screen-ppd/ : * Your 22" screen at a distance of 32" has a horizontal FOV of 33°. Moving your eyes from the middle of one screen to the adjacent screen is a 33° movement. Assuming 1080p it would have a PPD of 58, which is roughly retina PPD. * My 27" screen at a distance of 20" (I measured it [update: originally measured at 14", remeasured…

Note there was an error in my math here which I can no longer correct. My 27" 4K at a distance of 20" has a PPD of 63, which is also considered retina. Compare this to the Vision Pro PPD of ~34.

To get true 4K res (3840x2160) at a PPD of 34 would require a screen that is 3840 / 34 = 113 degrees wide, way in excess of what is accessible by adduction of the human eye. A 60° wide screen would have a resolution of 60*34 = 2,040 pixels wide, or roughly 1080p.

Re: Working in the Vision Pro [video]

#160

Post by goosedragons »

snakeyjake wrote: post #134
wnevets wrote: post #26

This is starting to me remind of when everyone was talking about replacing their Desktop/Laptop with an iPad and a Bluetooth keyboard for their work machine. I don't know anyone who was able to do so successfully.

Unless your definition of "work" is limited to "programming locally" there are millions of people who have replaced their laptop with an iPad. There are millions more who use it as a content creation tool, despite HN users' insistence of that impossibility. One of my favorite youtubers (1M subscribers) produces his video content on and runs his channel from an iPad.

There's a lot of workflows that are hampered or impaired on an iPad beyond programming. Yeah, with kludges you can kinda get most or even all of it done but usually in a less efficient manner. Missing or limited programs, limitations on using peripherals, and moving data/files between apps drags things down.

Here's an example:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gosW702fFg4

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