Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

How to stop adulterated turmeric from killing people

economist.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

151–160 of 200 posts

Re: How to stop adulterated turmeric from killing people

#151

Post by HideousKojima »

pseudo0 wrote: post #25
freetime2 wrote: post #20

> Yet adulterated turmeric looks like a major culprit almost everywhere, chiefly owing to poor practice in India, which produces 75% of the spice. It’s really shocking to me that in the year 2023 people could be intentionally adding lead to food products at this scale. Is this mainly due to greed and corruption? Ignorance? Distrust of modern medicine and health advice? I suppose it’s similar to the problem of people…

It is reminiscent of the Austrian antifreeze wine scandal: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1985_Austrian_diethylene_gly... That was only a few wineries though, and it was pretty quickly caught and harshly punished. This is apparently a whole industry where the practice of poisoning consumers with lead is normalized.

Didn't realize that Simpsons episode was based on a real incident (though they depicted it in France, not Austria).

Re: How to stop adulterated turmeric from killing people

#152

Post by graphe »

mschuster91 wrote: post #130
ta_vf7xjd34cc wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> The British Empire might have disappeared but a segment of the English elite continue to believe that the former colonies must be run based on ideas that emerge from their superior intellect. Everyone and their dog knows that lead is dangerous. You don't need to have a "superior intellect" to realize this. > Most governments in Africa, Asia and South America must have first hand experience with why (and how) NGOs a…

Except this molecule isn't dangerous.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lead(II)_chromate

>Despite containing both lead and hexavalent chromium, lead chromate is not particularly toxic because of its very low solubility. The LD50 for rats is only 5,000 mg/kg. Lead chromate is treated with great care in its manufacture, the main concerns being dust of the chromate precursor. "Extensive epidemiological investigations have given no indication that the practically insoluble lead chromate pigments have any carcinogenic properties".

Re: How to stop adulterated turmeric from killing people

#153

Post by graphe »

The lead chromate isn't particularly dangerous.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lead(II)_chromate

>Despite containing both lead and hexavalent chromium, lead chromate is not particularly toxic because of its very low solubility. The LD50 for rats is only 5,000 mg/kg. Lead chromate is treated with great care in its manufacture, the main concerns being dust of the chromate precursor. "Extensive epidemiological investigations have given no indication that the practically insoluble lead chromate pigments have any carcinogenic properties".

The tumeric used in medicine are not pristine examples of 100% tumeric.

Re: How to stop adulterated turmeric from killing people

#154

Post by pseudo0 »

thih9 wrote: post #92
pseudo0 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is reminiscent of the Austrian antifreeze wine scandal: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1985_Austrian_diethylene_gly... That was only a few wineries though, and it was pretty quickly caught and harshly punished. This is apparently a whole industry where the practice of poisoning consumers with lead is normalized.

> That was only a few wineries though (…) The article you linked shows it was more than that and that the country’s industry was affected.

Because of the practice of blending wines into other wines. So a few criminal wineries impacted orders of magnitude more blended wine production.

The distinction I was trying to draw was that unless there is a similar practice of blending for tumeric, this a systemic, widespread issue where the practice of poisoning customers has become normalized in the industry.

Re: How to stop adulterated turmeric from killing people

#155

Post by alephnerd »

Zufriedenheit wrote: post #43
freetime2 wrote: post #20

> Yet adulterated turmeric looks like a major culprit almost everywhere, chiefly owing to poor practice in India, which produces 75% of the spice. It’s really shocking to me that in the year 2023 people could be intentionally adding lead to food products at this scale. Is this mainly due to greed and corruption? Ignorance? Distrust of modern medicine and health advice? I suppose it’s similar to the problem of people…

One major factor is ignoring evidence based medicine. In India you can still commonly buy traditional medicines which have heavy metals like lead and mercury as ingredients.

Not ignored. EBM can be expensive or simply unavailable.

Aryuveda/Unani and Homeopathic Medicine is often the only form of "medicine" available for those in very poor areas.

Govt clinics and dispensaries might be overloaded and private healthcare is too expensive, so if you're a substinence farmer in eastern Uttar Pradesh or Bihar (let alone poorer areas across India), traditional medicines or homeopathic medicine is your only affordable choice.

Oftentimes the medicine provided is basically just steroids (they can make you feel better in the short term)

Re: How to stop adulterated turmeric from killing people

#156

Post by alephnerd »

lakomen wrote: post #102
supriyo-biswas wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In India, it is usually small-time tradesmen that are involved in the act of adulteration, and any action is likely to be considered as an attack on small businesses.

I don't really care what it's being considered as. They poison people for profit. Atrocious, it's essentially long term mass murder including children.

In India, elections can be flipped by margins of only a couple thousand voters.

This is why enforcement might be lax. Local enforcement doesn't want to mess with small businesses or unions (eg. Auto rickshaw unions) lest they lose their seat.

Stuff like this will continue to happen for 2 generations (and maybe even longer). Look at China as an example, and even South Korea. They are 15 and 40 years ahead of India respectively and even they have had issues Food and Drug safety to this day.

Re: How to stop adulterated turmeric from killing people

#157

Post by otikik »

supriyo-biswas wrote: post #53
otikik wrote: post #31

Close their business, put them in jail.

In India, it is usually small-time tradesmen that are involved in the act of adulteration, and any action is likely to be considered as an attack on small businesses.

Well if small businesses attack children, I attack small businesses. It doesn’t need to be complicated.

Re: How to stop adulterated turmeric from killing people

#158

Post by alephnerd »

Havoc wrote: post #28

Reminds me of the China milk scandal.

Pretty much.

India is essentially China 15-17 years ago (both a good and a bad thing).

Demographics, FDI, HDI, GDP per Capita, Infrastrucutre investment, the kinds of scandals, and even the kind of criticism seen against India in 2023 are very similar to what you'd see about China in the early 2000s.

Re: How to stop adulterated turmeric from killing people

#160

Post by otikik »

alephnerd wrote: post #156
lakomen wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't really care what it's being considered as. They poison people for profit. Atrocious, it's essentially long term mass murder including children.

In India, elections can be flipped by margins of only a couple thousand voters. This is why enforcement might be lax. Local enforcement doesn't want to mess with small businesses or unions (eg. Auto rickshaw unions) lest they lose their seat. Stuff like this will continue to happen for 2 generations (and maybe even longer). Look at China as an example, and even South Korea. They are 15 and 40 years ahead of India res…

I am no political expert, but “my opponent is harming your children’s health” seems like it can move some votes.
Post reply on HN