Microsoft is bringing Python to Excel • Hacker News Board

Re: Microsoft is bringing Python to Excel

#151

Post by nonethewiser » Tue, Aug 22, 2023, 3:06 PM UTC

layer8 wrote: post #46

cableshaft wrote: post #13

I wish it wasn't solely powered only by Microsoft Cloud and could support python running locally, but regardless I think this will still be huge and single-handedly modernizes Excel by a large margin. This alone could eliminate the need for websites that just want this sort of data. I can think of a past project at a previous job I did building an analytics website used only by a handful of people internally that cou…

It sort of makes sense to limit it to the cloud, because making Python an integral part of the Excel file format would reduce its portability and introduce all sorts of compatibility headaches going forward.

> It sort of makes sense to limit it to the cloud, because making Python an integral part of the Excel file format

Moving it from the cloud to local doesn't make it an integral part of the Excel file format. Whatever python service is running in the cloud could just run locally.

Re: Microsoft is bringing Python to Excel

#152

Post by csdvrx » Tue, Aug 22, 2023, 3:06 PM UTC

mrits wrote: post #121

baz00 wrote: post #81

I have to see some red flags here. The very nature and power of Excel comes from the fact that workbooks can stand alone. This means that the process is eternally tied to the cloud now. So when you, 3 years down the line, have to open a workbook from your deceased colleague, you are at the whim of the vendor supporting the existence of this integration. Step one of any workload will always be "work out how to make th…

I haven't used a non-cloud spreadsheet in probably 7 years. I also wouldn't use excel for anything that has a combination of high importance and long lifetime though. It's mostly for some brainstorming or thrown in a presentation as a screenshot.

> I haven't used a non-cloud spreadsheet in probably 7 years.

Last time I use a cloud spreasheet was a month ago, to download the content into Excel

> I also wouldn't use excel for anything that has a combination of high importance and long lifetime though. It's mostly for some brainstorming or thrown in a presentation as a screenshot.

It's funny but that's exactly how I see online spreadsheet: for unimportant things that may not work at any point in the future if the account is closed. However, the collaborative features make them nice for brainstorming.

Re: Microsoft is bringing Python to Excel

#153

Post by dragonwriter » Tue, Aug 22, 2023, 3:07 PM UTC

> Microsoft says Python in Excel will be included in a Microsoft 365 subscription during the preview, but “some functionality will be restricted without a paid license”

Microsoft 365 subscriptions are paid licenses. This sentence is nonsense.

Re: Microsoft is bringing Python to Excel

#154

Post by fzumstein » Tue, Aug 22, 2023, 3:08 PM UTC

cableshaft wrote: post #13

I wish it wasn't solely powered only by Microsoft Cloud and could support python running locally, but regardless I think this will still be huge and single-handedly modernizes Excel by a large margin. This alone could eliminate the need for websites that just want this sort of data. I can think of a past project at a previous job I did building an analytics website used only by a handful of people internally that cou…

> I wish it wasn't solely powered only by Microsoft Cloud and could support python running locally

Have a look at xlwings, which runs on any cloud and also locally.

Re: Microsoft is bringing Python to Excel

#155

Post by jimmychoozyx » Tue, Aug 22, 2023, 3:08 PM UTC

DIY:

-> excel cell: rest api call

-> send request to your own python web app: run python function. send back the output.

Re: Microsoft is bringing Python to Excel

#156

Post by niam » Tue, Aug 22, 2023, 3:08 PM UTC

cableshaft wrote: post #13

I wish it wasn't solely powered only by Microsoft Cloud and could support python running locally, but regardless I think this will still be huge and single-handedly modernizes Excel by a large margin. This alone could eliminate the need for websites that just want this sort of data. I can think of a past project at a previous job I did building an analytics website used only by a handful of people internally that cou…

It running in Microsoft Cloud is precisely what I think will actually allow this to be useful functionality for my company in ways that macros aren't, because macros are seen here to present a vector for running malware on client machines, whose utility doesn't justify the risk.

Re: Microsoft is bringing Python to Excel

#157

Post by snickerbockers » Tue, Aug 22, 2023, 3:10 PM UTC

So what happens when you're trying to work on your laptop and you don't have a reliable Internet connection?

Re: Microsoft is bringing Python to Excel

#158

Post by fzumstein » Tue, Aug 22, 2023, 3:10 PM UTC

cableshaft wrote: post #74

inglor wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hi I work on Excel, can you write a summary of why that's important to you and send it to bgruenbaum@microsoft.com ? I'll get it in front of a PM. Alternatively PMs read all the feedback sent via the feedback UI on Excel web and desktop so you can use that instead if you prefer.

I think it's similar to the current generative A.I. trend. The companies I work for while consulting (mainly financial and health organizations) have been very cautious about any company or PII data going to these A.I. programs, and the cloud in general, and are looking to make their own local run generative A.I. LLMs for their employees to use. By it's very nature these Excel documents will be filled with company da…

> By it's very nature these Excel documents will be filled with company data, so I can imagine these companies would also be a bit cautious sending those calculations to the cloud, especially if they can't control the flow of data from their I.T. departments via web applications.

This is exactly what I see when talking to users about xlwings: it needs to run on their end, behind their firewall, in exactly the cloud they have picked (AWS, GCP, Azure).

Re: Microsoft is bringing Python to Excel

#159

Post by csdvrx » Tue, Aug 22, 2023, 3:10 PM UTC

walthamstow wrote: post #82

tigeroil wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looking at what they're doing with Outlook I'd bet money that they intend to replace the desktop version of Excel with the web version sooner or later.

I agree but expect that Excel will be the very last app of the suite that they make web-only. Excel heads like my wife absolutely hate the web version.

> Excel heads like my wife absolutely hate the web version.

Have her try Excel 2010 or 2007 running on Wine (whether using WSL or natively)

For people who want their spreadsheet offline, it's wonderful: fast and stable.

Re: Microsoft is bringing Python to Excel

#160

Post by graypegg » Tue, Aug 22, 2023, 3:11 PM UTC

inglor wrote: post #49

cableshaft wrote: post #13

I wish it wasn't solely powered only by Microsoft Cloud and could support python running locally, but regardless I think this will still be huge and single-handedly modernizes Excel by a large margin. This alone could eliminate the need for websites that just want this sort of data. I can think of a past project at a previous job I did building an analytics website used only by a handful of people internally that cou…

Hi I work on Excel, can you write a summary of why that's important to you and send it to bgruenbaum@microsoft.com ? I'll get it in front of a PM. Alternatively PMs read all the feedback sent via the feedback UI on Excel web and desktop so you can use that instead if you prefer.

Is there any technical reason excel couldn’t ship with Python? The license allows it [1] and it would probably solve the issue of all users being able to open any document like the cloud solution, but still run locally.

[1] https://wiki.python.org/moin/PythonSoftwareFoundationLicense...