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The myth of the eight-hour sleep

bbc.co.uk

151–160 of 168 posts

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#151

I am really into 'do what works for you'. You may find that that sleeping in two 4 hour blocks changes your life. You feel alive! Alternatively you may find yourself more tired. Personally I like sleeping 8-9 hours a night. I find myself fairly alert a few minutes after I wake up and I can start my day. It certainly doesn't feel 'unnatural' to me. I am also a big fan of sleeping when other people sleep so I can enjoy…

We often miss our sleep because we think we are missing on things.

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#152
My sleep is a lot more deep when I regularly sleep around 7 hours. Anything less or over makes me restless. I think I am going to try this. If I get up in middle of night, I will work for an hour or two and when I feel sleepy, I will go to bed.

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#153
post #2

Oh my God. This could change my life. One lifelong problem I've got is sleeping. I have great trouble falling asleep, and my sleeping patterns are very uncommon: some days I sleep 12 hours, some 5, but I'm usually very tired because of this. However, I used to think I had a "gift" of being really creative and having my best ideas just before sleep, just waking up, and during insomnia episodes. However, I've discovere…

You're definitely not alone. Extraordinary insight and creativity, rich, vivid, inspired and out-of-the-box thinking, are typical for "twilight" states, when you're floating between waking state and sleep; not fully awaken to the outside world, but not fully unconscious either. The only problem is replicating and maintaining these states. It is sometimes possible to remain fully aware in what is essentially a full-on…

A few times in my life I've had these between state experiences. I'm not sure what triggered them or why they happened. And I can't recall fully the details of what I saw. However, I can remember the effect it had on my mind.

Once it was morning, but I was not awake. I saw a tablet with writing on it, infinite detail like a fractal going deeper and deeper. But I knew I wasn't awake, my eyes were closed. But the clarity was amazing. My eyes were closed and yet I saw like as if my eyes were open. I told myself this is what having photographic memory must be like.

Another time it was morning again and I thought I was awake. But I saw things floating in the air, like holograms of objects. And somehow I knew, I was still sleeping, but not sleeping. What I saw was a perfect memory recall of my room, a place I had seen thousands of times. But it was all in my mind and my mind could insert impossible objects at will.

Yet another time I heard the most beautiful music. I'm not a musician, and I can't remember anything about the music. I just remember it was amazing, like something bach would create.

These weren't like normal dreams which are forgotten soon after waking. They left a lasting impression, and even though I can't recall the images or the music, somehow I can remember the awe and wonder of the experience.

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#154
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Link to relevant article for people who are interested: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siesta .

Siesta (midday nap) is very common in Bolivia, Mexico and other Latin American countries, but I'd hesitate to call it segmented sleep.

Not to detract from your main point, but I don't think Siesta is very common in Mexico and most other Latin American countries. I was born in Cuba, lived there for five years and lived in Mexico for about three or four. I don't know of a single person who regularly slept after noon.

In fact, I had an opportunity to live in Barcelona for three months and while a lot of businesses do close down from noon to three, I got the impression that people were not using that time to sleep, and that the idea of siesta in Catalunya is on the decline.

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#155
post #146
post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

References, many by Ekirch but not all: http://www.history.vt.edu/Ekirch/sleepcommentary.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Segmented_sleep http://www.historycooperative.org/journals/ahr/106.2/ah00034... http://www.sciencenews.org/sn_arc99/9_25_99/bob2.htm http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/sleep-disorders/content/arti... http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1365-2869.2008.... http://www.nature.com/scientificamer…

It's interesting that the references of yours that are scientific studies are all in the last 6 years (which is when I say I was more out of the loop). This is hardly "known and accepted for decades".

It was originally published in 1993, and you make it seem like if you didn't know about it it didn't exist.

Although in your defense, it's not widely known. (Most people never even think to ask, although once they do the evidence is compelling.)

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#156
post #61

Google ngram explorer has the term 'first sleep' peaking in use in English Language circa 1870, before declining ~80% to present day. http://bit.ly/zt8AfD Tough to say if this was a 19th century phenomenon or was persistent through history based on the structure of their corpus.

It does not seem to be relevant, as it seems to track along with the general use of the word 'sleep'

http://i.imgur.com/4AtC1.png

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#157
post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I had a "gift" of being really creative and having my best ideas just before sleep, just waking up, and during insomnia episodes." This is called Hypnogogia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypnogogia The only way I can definitely replicate it is to stay up all night. The next day I will feel a lot more creative, but at the same time a lot less coordinated, frequently tired and not able to concentrate on doing something…

I remember reading about a famous inventor (can't remember who, sorry) who purposefully induced this state by holding something in his hand which would make a noise when let go. While falling asleep, the object (say, a metal ball) would drop (into say, a metal bowl), making enough noise to wake him up just as he was falling asleep. If an idea came he would write it down, if not he would repeat the process.

Salvador Dali:

http://www.arthurmag.com/2010/06/25/diy-magic-dropping-the-s...

The comments on that mention Thomas Edison also doing something similar.

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#158
There's a Zen saying relevant to the article (and to much of the discussion here). Rather than wringing your hands over "optimal sleep", I suggest trying it out. If your schedule allows, it can work wonders:

When hungry, eat. When tired, sleep.

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#159
post #155
post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's interesting that the references of yours that are scientific studies are all in the last 6 years (which is when I say I was more out of the loop). This is hardly "known and accepted for decades".

It was originally published in 1993, and you make it seem like if you didn't know about it it didn't exist. Although in your defense, it's not widely known. (Most people never even think to ask, although once they do the evidence is compelling.)

... 'it' refers to which reference?

ref 1 seems to be a series of excerpts of articles ref 2 is a literature review of historical acounts

neither ref 1 nor 2 is a scientific study, and according to the dates come from around 2000

ref 3 wiki article referencing articles from 2005, ref 4 is science journalism and refers to a 1993 study

remaining refs are all studies from 2006+

So, yes, I didn't know it existed. I've never heard sleep professionals talk about it in my career to 2006ish. Good sleep was pretty universally considered a contiguous segment of uninterrupted sleep with particular cycles by sleep practitioners. My problem is not with the content - I'm open to learning about new things about stuff I 'know' - but with your description of it being something well-known and universally accepted for a long time.

I think it's fascinating, and thank you for providing references. But it's really a very new avenue of formally studied biology.

Re: The myth of the eight-hour sleep

#160
post #159
post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was originally published in 1993, and you make it seem like if you didn't know about it it didn't exist. Although in your defense, it's not widely known. (Most people never even think to ask, although once they do the evidence is compelling.)

... 'it' refers to which reference? ref 1 seems to be a series of excerpts of articles ref 2 is a literature review of historical acounts neither ref 1 nor 2 is a scientific study, and according to the dates come from around 2000 ref 3 wiki article referencing articles from 2005, ref 4 is science journalism and refers to a 1993 study remaining refs are all studies from 2006+ So, yes, I didn't know it existed. I've ne…

> and universally accepted

I didn't mean among practitioners, I meant among research, i.e. that there isn't significant criticism, which to me makes it accepted. It's normal for there to be huge lag between research and practice, especially since research is frequently wrong.

I remember reading about this many many years ago, and it was written as if it had been known for even longer before that. But I guess the recent references seem to start with 1993 which is long, but not as long as I thought it was.

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