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Between a rock and a hard place – our decision to abandon the Mac App Store

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Re: Between a rock and a hard place – our decision to abandon the Mac App Store

#151
post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's another kind of applications, besides dev tools, that's going to be affected by this. I'm a user of one of Apple's "pro" applications, Logic Pro 9, a top music recording software (or DAW). I started using it long before it was put in the appstore, and was surprised when they moved it there, as it was a 5 DVD install. Anyways ... the tool interacts with plugins written in a Logic Pro independent standard, VST.…

>Is Apple going to cripple Logic Studio? Or will they also have to take their "pro" software out of the appstore? The answer is simple, Apple's apps will have special access that will make them better than 3rd party apps which have to jump through all these hoops.

Except that you just made this up. Do you really think Apple doesn't know people are on the lookout for just such behavior?

Re: Between a rock and a hard place – our decision to abandon the Mac App Store

#152
post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Is Apple going to cripple Logic Studio? Or will they also have to take their "pro" software out of the appstore? The answer is simple, Apple's apps will have special access that will make them better than 3rd party apps which have to jump through all these hoops.

Except that you just made this up. Do you really think Apple doesn't know people are on the lookout for just such behavior?

What can anyone do about it really? They hide behind the 'is not a monopoly' excuse and there's nothing anyone can do.

Re: Between a rock and a hard place – our decision to abandon the Mac App Store

#153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(for whatever reason, I'm not allowed to reply directly to you) It's a cool-off period.

To keep me from advocating an unpopular, but entirely rational, position – all while other people freely misrepresent the First Amendment in response to my comments.

It's an algorithm, I'm pretty sure it has nothing against you.

Re: Between a rock and a hard place – our decision to abandon the Mac App Store

#154
post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's common courtesy to announce when one's surrendering an argument and starting a new one. "If the app store can truly compete with an open marketplace" As it turns out there is an open market for iOS apps and an open alternative to iOS and Apple's walled garden is competitive with both. "why won't apple let me install arbitrary software on my iDevice?" Aren't the reasons obvious? Simplicity, profit, security? You…

Since you've asked, Steko, I'll continue as if you're actually interested in exploring this topic with me. I promise I was trying to contribute to my argument and not change the subject. Please calm your fury. First, what is this open market for iOS apps you mentioned? I haven't heard of it. Of course Apple locks down the app store on their iDevices for profit. I think we're in agreement on that. If they didn't limit…

"Of course Apple locks down the app store on their iDevices for profit."

I doubt that Apple is solely concerned with profit and even if they were I guess I don't see that as the end of the world.

If Apple is solely concerned with profiting from apps why do they subsidize free ones and credit card fees? {If dev share is actually calculated post cc fees I'll plead ignorance and move on to the other part of the argument.}

99 cent app less 69 cents to developer less 40-70 cents to credit card company less bandwidth fees = loss.

(I've given a range on cc fees because they are shared if you purchase multiple apps within a few days, that mitigates the loss but ultimately someone motivated only by profit would be taking easily avoided losses all over the place in either scenario.)

Isn't it well known that Apple's direct profit on the App Store is a rounding error compared to their other business?

Isn't it then more likely then that their motivation is not primarily to directly profit from it?

While I do think Apple is interested in profit here, I very deliberately listed it as secondary to simplicity which is really at the heart of everything Apple does well. There's a book coming out soon about just this:

http://kensegall.com/blog/2012/02/and-now-a-different-kind-o...

The premise I'm building on is that Apple really profits by making great products that just work and make people happy. Having a super simple way to get apps is part of that.

For 98%+ of users 1 app store >> 2 app stores >> 10 app stores. One App Store just works. It also stops most malware without any action by the user. That's simplicity again.

"What I'm trying to express is my surprise that developers in the desktop world would opt in to a market like this"

I guess again I'll fall back on my Sears comparison. I don't know if Sears still sells software but they did for decades -- Wal-Mart still does for sure though and there's no way Wal-Mart is any more dev friendly then Apple. Way harder to get your product on the shelves at, harder to keep your product there, takes at least as large a cut, etc.

What Wal-Mart does have is tens of millions of customers though. Apple too. So of course devs are going to opt into those markets.

Re: Between a rock and a hard place – our decision to abandon the Mac App Store

#155
post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since you've asked, Steko, I'll continue as if you're actually interested in exploring this topic with me. I promise I was trying to contribute to my argument and not change the subject. Please calm your fury. First, what is this open market for iOS apps you mentioned? I haven't heard of it. Of course Apple locks down the app store on their iDevices for profit. I think we're in agreement on that. If they didn't limit…

"Of course Apple locks down the app store on their iDevices for profit." I doubt that Apple is solely concerned with profit and even if they were I guess I don't see that as the end of the world. If Apple is solely concerned with profiting from apps why do they subsidize free ones and credit card fees? {If dev share is actually calculated post cc fees I'll plead ignorance and move on to the other part of the argument…

Very true. I didn't try to imply in any previous post that being motivated by profit is a bad thing. The app store definitely provides the ultra-simple software ecosystem you mentioned, and I agree that's awesome for most users. It also happens to guarantee that apple will be in the pipeline for all sales, so it's really win-win.

Despite my surprise that anybody would use it, there are over a thousand apps on the mac app store, so apple must be adding value by getting the product in front of eyeballs and streamlining the payment process. Still, I don't think they'll be able to get away with the draconian rule that they enjoy in the iDevice world. After all, if they make the experience too unpleasant, developers can still sell software through a competing app store, their website, or by mailing you a CD-ROM if all else fails. I think this is a good thing - the "escape hatch" means they'll actually have to put effort into pleasing the vendors who use their channel.

You'll never see a "why we decided to abandon the iPhone app store" - the only choice in that world is to abandon the platform altogether.

Re: Between a rock and a hard place – our decision to abandon the Mac App Store

#156
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Once you are dealing with more than, say, two hundred pieces of information, you kind of start needing to classify that information and have definite ways to find it. If tags are a way that you can definitely find and specify a given file, then tags will form part of a new, distributed file system. If tags wind-up just being half-assed, uncertain hints to where files might be, then they will form part of a new, disfu…

I think you missed my point. I have thousands of photos "in" iPhoto, and I have no idea of any of the file names or their location on the file system. I don't care what they are called or where they are, I just want to have my photos. Sure, there might be a filesystem under there, but I have no interest in interacting with it directly.

"No you don't understand, these amplifiers go up to eleven..."

Even a flickin' unix whiz doesn't care about, say, which disk sector a file is located on. In fact, if they are using a distributed file system, they also can mostly ignore the physical location of the data.

Your spiffy net of tags is a way-to-find data. A officially "file system" is a way to find data. Each has some flexibility, some lack-of-ambiguity and some persistence over time. You may not care about the uniqueness, ambiguity and decay over time of your tag based way-to-find data. But that just means you've got a convenient but half-assed file system. Moreover,

Re: Between a rock and a hard place – our decision to abandon the Mac App Store

#157
post #94
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the real way we got homebrew in the wii in the first place was because of a awful RSA implementation done by outsourced devs in the USA. http://events.ccc.de/congress/2008/Fahrplan/events/2799.en.h...

Err, no, that came later. Much later. The original released homebrew was the Twilight Princess hack. There were a few others internal to the group first, but the attack you're referring to didn't happen until a good year, year and a half later.

i wasn't thinking. my bad
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