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Companies save billions of dollars by giving employees fake “manager” titles

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Re: Companies save billions of dollars by giving employees fake “manager” titles

#151

Post by ihatepython »

willcipriano wrote: post #10

I worked for a restaurant that did this to me. To make sure I hit the "minimum hours" (when you start talking about hours vs tasks or responsibilities you probably aren't getting into a legitimate salary arrangement) they would have me clock in and out, and I'd get pay stubs with 40 hours (less if I worked less) and the overtime hours paid at $0. They withheld my last paycheck when I quit and stopped responding to my…

All they had to do was give you your last paycheck, they would have saved 20k and gotten away with it

Re: Companies save billions of dollars by giving employees fake “manager” titles

#152

Post by pyuser583 »

realslimjd wrote: post #93
pxue wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a small government advocate, i have no issue with labor boards. the alternative is violence or unionization, neither of which are optimal in resolving disputes like these in a civilized and efficient manner.

What do unions have to do with small government? A union contract is an agreement between two private parties.

But it’s not. There are tons and tons of “union laws” that treat unions very differently than any other entity.

Some of these laws hurt unions, others help.

For example, a union contract can’t require an employer to hire only union members.

That would create a situation where people would apply to the union first, and if they union accepted them, then they apply for the job.

That would give unions too much power, so it’s not allowed.

Another law forbids sympathy strikes. Unions can only strike against their own employers, not in sympathy with other strikers.

Modern labor law also seeks to discourage strikes by using a war-game like approach to negotiating. Maybe a good idea, maybe not. But certainly not something that happens for non-union orgs.

If we adopted a “hands off” approach to unions, we could easily wind up with insanely powerful unions.

If 2% of the working population went on strike simultaneously, the economy would stop working quickly.

So general strikes are very illegal, even though they are 100% in accord with libertarian ideology.

Re: Companies save billions of dollars by giving employees fake “manager” titles

#153

Post by nostrademons »

MisterBastahrd wrote: post #121
willcipriano wrote: post #10

I worked for a restaurant that did this to me. To make sure I hit the "minimum hours" (when you start talking about hours vs tasks or responsibilities you probably aren't getting into a legitimate salary arrangement) they would have me clock in and out, and I'd get pay stubs with 40 hours (less if I worked less) and the overtime hours paid at $0. They withheld my last paycheck when I quit and stopped responding to my…

When I was an 11 year old, I got a job working for a local swim club. I'd go to the property, open the gate, and clean the grounds and take out the trash. They figured since I wasn't technically old enough to work, they could pay me $2.30 an hour when $4.25 was the minimum wage at the time. I adjusted my recorded hours versus worked hours accordingly. Given that there were no cameras on premises, the timesheets were…

"We pretend to work and they pretend to pay." -- Soviet Russia

Re: Companies save billions of dollars by giving employees fake “manager” titles

#154

Post by pyuser583 »

fHr wrote: post #72
pxue wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a small government advocate, i have no issue with labor boards. the alternative is violence or unionization, neither of which are optimal in resolving disputes like these in a civilized and efficient manner.

Unionization is amazing. I do not know why especially people in US are so against this. Did they just gave up and are okay with the big corps fucking them over withouth having any leverage?

My mom was a nurse. She helped unionize her profession back in the 1960s.

By the time she retired in 21st century, she hated her union.

She particularly hated their support for Obamacare. They had an exception so it didn’t affect their agreements. But that ignored the fact that the nurses had to actually implement it.

It was an administrative clusterf*ck. Nurses spent hours listening to consultants telling them how to improve patient reviews, which were now tied to compensation.

The unions were like “the Democrats now owe us, so we will get paid back down the road.”

She literally quit over that.

Re: Companies save billions of dollars by giving employees fake “manager” titles

#155

Post by fooker »

WesternWind wrote: post #150
hourago wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the alternative is violence or unionization, neither of which are optimal in resolving disputes like these in a civilized and efficient manner. Unionization is a great way of solving disputes. Many big corporations need to be counter-weight with some other big organization. To put violence and unions at the same level seems uncalled for.

Folks with union jobs tend do better then their same industry non union counterparts, in terms of wages, health care, access to sick days, etc. There is however a third choice, which is government regulation. Unfortunately government regulations can't adapt as quickly as a union can to changes. Maybe the relatively inflexibility of regulation is what is needed to maintain a minimum necessary commitment to living wage…

> Folks with union jobs tend do better

Just like planes which survived battles only had bullet marks on their wings.

Re: Companies save billions of dollars by giving employees fake “manager” titles

#156

Post by nostrademons »

LarryMullins wrote: post #148
MisterBastahrd wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I was an 11 year old, I got a job working for a local swim club. I'd go to the property, open the gate, and clean the grounds and take out the trash. They figured since I wasn't technically old enough to work, they could pay me $2.30 an hour when $4.25 was the minimum wage at the time. I adjusted my recorded hours versus worked hours accordingly. Given that there were no cameras on premises, the timesheets were…

Reminds me of a lifeguarding job I had at a private lake club when I was a teen. They let me report and set my own hours. I never abused that trust, but it was pretty strange when my boss explained that they'd pay me for however much I chose to work during daylight hours (the lake was "closed" after dark.) I did end up working a few very long days on holidays for the extra cash.

I do wonder how many of these are honeypots to see which workers they'd like to invite back next year.

It's pretty well-known that the point of an internship isn't to actually accomplish any useful work, it's to determine which students you would like to extend an offer to for full-time employment. Not a large leap to assume that a lot of adolescent employment follows this pattern. The wages you'd pay a teen are chump change for most businesses, but responsible, intelligent, trustworthy employees basically disappear from the job market after their first job (because everybody wants to keep them), and so it can be a great investment to identify, vet, and introduce yourself to them before they're on the open market.

Re: Companies save billions of dollars by giving employees fake “manager” titles

#157

Post by pyuser583 »

mistrial9 wrote: post #103
fHr wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unionization is amazing. I do not know why especially people in US are so against this. Did they just gave up and are okay with the big corps fucking them over withouth having any leverage?

more than a hundred years ago, the USA was not a large world power.. more than half the country was frontier and a lot of raw agriculture that is dependent on labor. When the 'red' social flames burned through Europe at the end of the Great Monarchies, political people here in the USA were seriously worried. So an ugly deal was forged.. the hardcore lefts were jailed and harassed and beaten.. and insider right wing g…

Another interpretation is that the New Deal institutionalized labor. Labor got a seat at the table in exchange for removing radical elements.

Re: Companies save billions of dollars by giving employees fake “manager” titles

#158

Post by gitfan86 »

ajmurmann wrote: post #30
gitfan86 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unlimited is such an absurd word. It should be "Flexible". It should be we will NOT fire you if you take 23.5 days instead of the ideal number of 22. Also, if you take 18 that is not a problem either.

It's not "flexible" either. It's "non-accrued". The only reason it's non-accrued is so that the company doesn't have to pay you left over PTO when you leave the company and gets it off their books. Everything else is a euphemism to make employees feel good about getting fewer benefits. You could have this flexibility with accrued PTO. I've previously given employees additional, off-the-books time off because they nee…

I don't want accrued benefits. That means that someone owes me 1000s of dollars and I cannot have that debt honored unless I quit my job?

I generally try to work at places that value my contributions but do not try to micromanage me. If I want/need to take time off, I do. If at some point I'm taking off so much time that they no longer feel that I'm contributing enough to the company, then fine they can let me go.

Re: Companies save billions of dollars by giving employees fake “manager” titles

#159

Post by anonuser123456 »

fHr wrote: post #72
pxue wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a small government advocate, i have no issue with labor boards. the alternative is violence or unionization, neither of which are optimal in resolving disputes like these in a civilized and efficient manner.

Unionization is amazing. I do not know why especially people in US are so against this. Did they just gave up and are okay with the big corps fucking them over withouth having any leverage?

Maybe you should stop thinking that the working class is stupid and start thinking about why they rejected unions.

My working class family members (all in the same trade) universally hate unions and their reasons are quite reasonable; my grandfather was in union leadership until he was run out by the mob and my cousin had to pay tribute (e.g a protection racket) to the new leadership.

Re: Companies save billions of dollars by giving employees fake “manager” titles

#160

Post by sangnoir »

lcnPylGDnU4H9OF wrote: post #81
willcipriano wrote: post #10

I worked for a restaurant that did this to me. To make sure I hit the "minimum hours" (when you start talking about hours vs tasks or responsibilities you probably aren't getting into a legitimate salary arrangement) they would have me clock in and out, and I'd get pay stubs with 40 hours (less if I worked less) and the overtime hours paid at $0. They withheld my last paycheck when I quit and stopped responding to my…

> Couple weeks later they send me a check for 20 grand out of the blue Glad this ended up working out in your favor. Your story makes me wonder how often such a practice doesn't end with the employer forking up the 20 grand they stole. I guess I've heard it said that wage theft is the most common form of theft but this is still rather frustrating to think about. Does this sort of practice come with some other punishm…

> Your story makes me wonder how often such a practice doesn't end with the employer forking up the 20 grand they stole.

As gp showed, most people are not fully aware of their labor rights, and when they are, may not know the remedies available to them. Wage theft is endemic because of information asymmetry.

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