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How Equifax Became a Private IRS

mattstoller.substack.com

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Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#151

Post by alistairSH »

Roark66 wrote: post #137

Seriously, is it true equifax in US "sells information about how much you earn" to anyone or is the article horribly misleading? I don't know about US, but some time ago I had dealt with Equifax in UK (when getting a car loan for example, then when renting a flat) and I was told by the paperwork I was given to sign authorising them to run "a credit check" they'll get the following info only: - confirmation of your de…

Not sure about Equifax specifically, but yes, several of the credit agencies also sell salary info. HR departments can use to see what you earn currently before making a job offer, etc. It's awful.

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#152

Post by medvezhenok »

sokoloff wrote: post #140
coredog64 wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

0/infinity is still zero

The balances are instantaneous balances, not ones that are being financed. So, if you use and pay off your card every month (as makes sense to me for points/cash back, ease of chargeback, and convenience), then your numerator won't be zero on most days. (For me, it's not $0 on any days, because of the timing of statements.)

You could theoretically pay off the card before the statement posts to keep the balance at zero. Usually not worth it, but if you want to boost your credit score before getting a mortgage, that trick usually works.

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#153

Post by datavirtue »

No1 wrote: post #90

Forget freezing the data, where do you make a CCPA delete request?

Not to mention the dire warning on the page about making it difficult to get a new job, mortgage, or obtain access to public healthcare benefits if you don't unfreeze before applying. Typical strongman shit.

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#154

Post by DSMan195276 »

gruez wrote: post #73
TheDong wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My parents taught me that debt was bad. They told me that credit cards were traps to get you into debt, that preyed on poor impulse control, and that it was better not to have one. If you can't tell, my parents grew up in a time when the credit score system didn't really matter, and didn't understand it. I did not get a credit card. I did not have any loans, for school or anything else. My credit score wasn't even a…

>My credit score wasn't even a number, it just didn't exist. Even the bank I banked with, which could see that I had more than $8k USD deposited monthly, that could see I had $30k in an account with them, would not give me a loan to buy a car. Right, because it's a credit score, not a finance score. I'm not sure what you want here. Do you want credit bureaus to collect even more information about your financial life…

> Right, because it's a credit score, not a finance score. I'm not sure what you want here. Do you want credit bureaus to collect even more information about your financial life so they can have a more accurate picture?

To some extent _yes_, if that's how this has to work. If my ability to make significant life steps is based entirely on their view of my ability to pay debts then I would rather they at least have the full picture. As it is it's extremely inconsistent, one place I rented reported my rent payments to some of the credit bureaus (but not all of them), the others did not. Additionally utility bills don't appear, despite them probably being a reasonable gauge of whether you can pay for stuff on time (at least as reasonable as everything else they use).

It is what it is, but I was in that poster's same position and agree with them that it feels like a very dumb situation. I'm lucky that I at least saw it coming and a few years before buying a house I opened a credit card with the only purpose being to build my credit history. I have one thing that charges about ~$8 a month to it and it gets auto paid, and apparently _that_ was a big key to determining whether I'll be able to manage paying for a house. IMO that's just silly.

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#155

Post by SketchySeaBeast »

phpisthebest wrote: post #149
minton wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think people underestimate the importance of physical cash. It’s annoying, sure, but it affords a type of freedom that won’t be replaced once lost. I wish more people understood this. Sadly, most people seem willing to trade a tiny bit of convenience today for a worse future tomorrow—for example, the tipless, cash-only coffee shop on the HN front page. I guess, like smokers, people don’t believe there’ll be consequ…

>>I guess, like smokers, people don’t believe there’ll be consequences until it’s too late. I wonder with this comment is irony or not? So let me ask, did you support the banning of smoking by government there by denying people the right to body autonomy, deny business the right to control their property, and deny consumers the right to choose for themselves the types of business they transact with? (aka freedom of a…

I think all they were saying with that is that the long term consequences of smoking is often a problem that isn't apparent until it's too late, which is very much true, but it seems some jimmies were rustled.

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#156

Post by connor11528 »

coderintherye wrote: post #26

One thing Matt mentions but doesn't go into is how this could (should?) be a government service. In fact, there is the IRS's IVES program: https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/inco... but it is already fairly antiquated. There's a great opportunity here for the IRS to provide this service (with revenue from charging the requesting entities), with citizens being self-sovereign over what data is shar…

I could see the IRS offering some service to enter the market and compete with Equifax to bring more competition to the sector. They might have to compel Equifax to give up some data or data sources to the government and their competitors. The government did this in WW2, forcing companies to give trade secrets to their competitors so there would be a more resilient supply chain.

Something similar could be done to break up big banking if the US Postal Service allowed people to open up super simple checking and savings accounts.

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#157

Post by coldpie »

tarranoth wrote: post #135
refurb wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve never had a credit card with fees. I built up a great credit score with a single, no fee card, that I paid off each month. Total cost $0. You don’t need an interest paying loan to have a good credit score.

I don't understand the US credit score at all. What's the predictive value of you paying off a mortgage based on you just shopping with a credit card? Sure if you can't pay your normal shopping cart, probably you shouldn't really be getting a mortgage, but the predictive value besides that seems lost on me. Surely a bank could just ask your payslip info and get a more accurate feel whether or not you are creditworthy…

> Surely a bank could just ask your payslip info and get a more accurate feel whether or not you are creditworthy?

They do that, too. You have to provide all of your income data over the past like 3 years and explain any extra income (why did your parents give you $1000 a couple years ago?). Credit score is just one more datapoint, and I think it's more about your score being "not bad" (i.e. you didn't screw a previous creditor) than it is about it being "good."

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#158

Post by gruez »

epgui wrote: post #112
gruez wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can know in the most obvious subset of cases of error, but if your score is 573 and it's supposed to be 605, good luck figuring that out. Presumably you're talking about the case where somebody never checks their credit report, goes out to get a car loan or whatever, and gets a worse interest rate because there's an error on their report. My question is, what are they supposed to do? They're already required to…

> what are they supposed to do Just because I haven't been repeating myself enough, the first thing I'm suggesting they could do is publish their credit scoring methodology. Your comment is irrelevant to what I said.

>the first thing I'm suggesting they could do is publish their credit scoring methodology

What's that supposed to accomplish? At the end of the day, a credit score is ultimately supposed to tell the lender what % chance you're going to default. Suppose the data is already accurate (remember, you can already request your credit report to check whether it's accurate), what additional value does having the methodology provide? Are you doubting their ability to correctly execute the model? Or do you want to dispute the fact that their model gave you a credit score of 573 when you think it should be 605?

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#159

Post by college_physics »

minton wrote: post #147
college_physics wrote: post #124

The final act of the dystopic digital transition we are witnessing is when the (until recently ringfenced) information flows of the broader financial system start getting commingled with the other digital activity already being collected and monitored. With the headlong rush to eliminate physical cash soon there will be no opt-out whatsoever. As the world of old oligopolies dies and a worse one emerges, the grotesque…

I think people underestimate the importance of physical cash. It’s annoying, sure, but it affords a type of freedom that won’t be replaced once lost. I wish more people understood this. Sadly, most people seem willing to trade a tiny bit of convenience today for a worse future tomorrow—for example, the tipless, cash-only coffee shop on the HN front page. I guess, like smokers, people don’t believe there’ll be consequ…

what I find baffling is that supposedly enlightened societies like Sweden are at the forefront of this cashless "revolution". Maybe they are simply overconfident / delusional about their ability to control the risks of the digital age or maybe the progressiveness was a shtick all along, confined to signature issues and not applicable towards the outstanding challenge of building a truly democratic and free digital society.

Re: How Equifax Became a Private IRS

#160

Post by [deleted] »

phpisthebest wrote: post #150
jasonjayr wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? Government answers to it's people. Equifax answers to it's shareholders. IRS already has that info. The people have the power to control and influence how that data is handled, and distributed. We have no power to compel Equifax to do anything.

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