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Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

cdoyle.me

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Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#151

Post by fundad »

frellus wrote: post #10

I get the whole "HR can be evil" point, but this article could have also been, "Having friends in management is fine, but management is not your friend". Personally, I'm so sick of the cynicism in general. Can we make points and articles about protecting yourself, as an employee, without resorting to such things? As a manager in a company, I've both had friends in HR and also had HR been my friend. Need to fire that…

I wouldn't go around admitting that some horrible people are allowed to maintain power as HR managers and then ask where the cynicism is coming from.

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#152

Post by d0gsg0w00f »

javajosh wrote: post #117
acover wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is the nature of being a cop unethical? I agree there are abuses of the power but from what I've seen in real life it's important work.

Power is corrupting, and police have a de facto shit-ton of real, immediate power over everyone in their vicinity. They have a "martial law bubble" around them that allows them to physically assault you, put you in jail, and upend your whole life with very little effort. You will have no recourse, and they will suffer no consequences. You may file a complaint with the department, and it will be followed up on, poorly…

In my life experience an unsavory character turned law abiding citizen I found that I used to think ill of cops but after I changed, miraculously cops seemed to turn into amazing fantastic people.

So I take all of these "cops are evil" claims with a grain of salt and seek out more context clues to what would initiate an interaction with LEO in the first place.

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#153

Post by warcher »

acover wrote: post #43
OnlineGladiator wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Personally, I'm so sick of the cynicism in general. Personally, I'm so sick of there not being nearly enough cynicism in general. I've met cops that aren't total pieces of shit (who all ended up quitting in less than 5 years), but that doesn't mean cops aren't total pieces of shit. If the nature of the job is unethical, you should rightly call it out as such. HR's job is to pretend to be your friend while doing wha…

Why is the nature of being a cop unethical? I agree there are abuses of the power but from what I've seen in real life it's important work.

Police are tasked with maintaining law and order.

Laws are equal for all people.

Order is a set of subjective social rules that keeps everything in its "correct" place.

Maintaining order often requires not enforcing the law equally. This is the essential moral difficulty of the police. If you have people who appear poor in a rich neighborhood, they are highly likely to attract law enforcement attention at a minimum. Not because they've broken the law, but because they are out of place and "disorderly".

We really really like order, by the way. You can't just do away with the maintenance of order, although a strong argument could be made that we should not enforce it via state-licensed violence.

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#154

Post by kabdib »

HR is not there for you.

HR is not there for you.

HR is not there for you.

Do not forget this. The nicest, most approachable and apparently friendly HR staffer will happily stuff you down the chute if they are so directed.

Through bitter experience, I treat HR the way I treat the police; they can do good things and they can do bad things, but mostly it's best to avoid their attention altogether and assume that their actions will be for the authorities, always.

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#155

Post by fundad »

danielmarkbruce wrote: post #76
frellus wrote: post #10

I get the whole "HR can be evil" point, but this article could have also been, "Having friends in management is fine, but management is not your friend". Personally, I'm so sick of the cynicism in general. Can we make points and articles about protecting yourself, as an employee, without resorting to such things? As a manager in a company, I've both had friends in HR and also had HR been my friend. Need to fire that…

It's not cynicism. It's realism. The post acknowledges HR can be helpful.

If you believe you deserve constant adulation for earning the title of manager/POTUS/CEO, the reality seems like a cynical attack on your ego.

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#156

Post by watwut »

hardware2win wrote: post #31

I dont understand those bad experiences with HR here All hr stuff that ive been involved in was getting hired, questions about taxes, days off calculations and health provider related stuff Like... what happened to you?

Our company created HR and the result was surprisingly positive. The hiring process started to be way more organized - they made no decisions, but planned interviews, made sure they are when everyone is available and knows about them.

They were also available to explain labor laws, regulations and process whenever leader/manager needed it. That alone made a lot of stuff more predictable.

I was skeptical at first, but it was definitely an improvement.

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#157

Post by nerdponx »

duxup wrote: post #78
frellus wrote: post #10

I get the whole "HR can be evil" point, but this article could have also been, "Having friends in management is fine, but management is not your friend". Personally, I'm so sick of the cynicism in general. Can we make points and articles about protecting yourself, as an employee, without resorting to such things? As a manager in a company, I've both had friends in HR and also had HR been my friend. Need to fire that…

The cynicism does seem like a race to the bottom. It’s to the point that discussions are derailed by it with folks who feign knowledge about a topic just offer cynicism. Anything that’s doesn’t work right the empty response is a conspiracy of “oh that’s by design” as if people would otherwise always have things working… It’s endless online.

It's always been possible to feign knowledge and wisdom with cynicism, even before public discourse was carried out "online".

It's also always been possible to feign knowledge and wisdom with breathless enthusiasm or optimism. Fakery is fakery.

In general, we are not cynical enough. Humans have been out to take advantage of each other for as long as we have recorded history, and probably for much longer than that. Civilization is maintained in equilibrium between forces that seek to destroy each other, so you can and should assume that those forces exist and are currently and actively attempting to pursue their own gain at your expense. The heart of propaganda is convincing people to act against their own best interests. This is built into the essence of humanity.

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#158

Post by mathattack »

HR exists to maximize shareholder value, like every other function. They do things that sound nice in support of this. But don’t ever expect them to take someone’s side out of principle if that hurts shareholder value.

They push for anti-harassment policies because it’s good for shareholders. They normalize compensation because it’s good for shareholders. If they treat people good on the way out, it’s because it’s good for shareholders.

They’re no different than the Finance, Legal or any other department.

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#159

Post by garmain »

dogman144 wrote: post #144
elil17 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If someone's going to drive company culture, why shouldn't it be HR? They seem well qualified to do so. For example, someone in HR would be in a good position to do the research to figure out if work-from-home improves productivity or employee happiness, and they would also understand the tax and legal implications of a possible work-from-home policy.

What? How are they well qualified to do so. Culture comes from leadership and leaders. When this doesn’t happen, you get all sorts of organizational issues. HR are not leaders. Culture isn’t productive and clicks per hour research or something you can suss out from forced company fun sessions. This is a root of an issue in corporate America where management (and it’s offshoots like HR) is considered the mindset, and…

Exactly

Re: Having friends in HR is fine, but HR is not your friend

#160

Post by nullsense »

epicureanideal wrote: post #73
afarrell wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. And Engineers often have pet projects. Marketing often has a slightly odd artistic vision for something. People are gonna be people.

Pet projects by any department that aren't in the interests of the company should be discouraged. Especially by HR, because unlike an engineering pet project that may waste some time, pet projects by HR can significantly impact the quality of life of every employee at the company, cause people not to join the company or quit the company, and so on. Dysfunctional HR (which is almost all HR) is just about as bad as hav…

>pet projects by HR can significantly impact the quality of life of every employee at the company, cause people not to join the company or quit the company, and so on

Reminds me of the time I almost rage quit when HR's pet project was to implement a "baking roster" for the purposes of "team building".

Like... No effing way am I spending time baking shit just because you want a supply of freshly baked goods to eat? I'm a software engineer damnit.

Made my blood boil for sure.

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