NY Sabotages Right to Repair Bill [video] • Hacker News Board

Re: NY Sabotages Right to Repair Bill [video]

#151

Post by RobotToaster » Sat, Dec 31, 2022, 10:37 AM UTC

HWR_14 wrote: post #107

causi wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The law, however, had an exception, where no compensation is due if the flight is delayed or cancelled due to a safety issue. This makes no sense at all. If I order a pizza and it doesn't show up the reason it doesn't show up is completely irrelevant; they still owe me my money back.

They want to avoid the following situation. X% of the time a plane crashes and costs $Y. It costs $Z to cancel/delay a flight due to penalties and compensation. $Z > X% of $Y, therefore fly the unsafe flight. So they lower $Y in the case that it's a safety issue to save lives.

Wouldn't the genuine answer to that be to increase the cost of a plane crashing by a lot?

Re: NY Sabotages Right to Repair Bill [video]

#152

Post by pfoof » Sat, Dec 31, 2022, 10:39 AM UTC

silisili wrote: post #105

This is really sad. I used to watch Louis when he was coming up. I didn't even own an Apple device, I just liked how he'd treat customers and show all of us his approach, and how to do it, for free. The corrupt government ruined him. It turned a beautiful young mind ready to change the world into a really bitter person. That's not a knock against him, but against the NYS Government. Glad he moved away, and hope he ha…

His bitterness is a great trait of him that on every video makes you feel "I can relate"

Re: NY Sabotages Right to Repair Bill [video]

#153

Post by dietr1ch » Sat, Dec 31, 2022, 10:43 AM UTC

philistine wrote: post #87

COGlory wrote: post #66

I don't understand. The bill was passed with an overwhelming, veto-proof majority. Then it sat on the Governor's desk until she made changes (after intense lobbying)? But the NY legislature is not in session, but the bill is signed? So how were the changes approved by the legislature? What is the precise legal mechanism here? Is this legal? My initial impression is that this is an illegal act of tyranny and should be…

You can also blame the system. The fact any sort of executive official can rewrite what the legislative wrote is insane. To hell with your limericks about checks and balances. Once a bill's done, no one ought to be able to stop anything.

It's working as intended

Re: NY Sabotages Right to Repair Bill [video]

#154

Post by RobotToaster » Sat, Dec 31, 2022, 10:48 AM UTC

nrp wrote: post #32

For folks wondering how the late changes to the bill happened, you can see who funded the lobby efforts here: https://reports.ethics.ny.gov/publicquery/AssociatedFilings/...

I love how the USA essentially rebranded bribery and corruption as "lobbying", so it can pretend corruption is something that only happens elsewhere.

Re: NY Sabotages Right to Repair Bill [video]

#155

Post by lotsofpulp » Sat, Dec 31, 2022, 10:52 AM UTC

ThrustVectoring wrote: post #114

unity1001 wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> representative democracies / absolute democracies The dichotomy above is impossible to interpret. What does that even mean. So when a democracy is representative, the minority's will can override the majority's will? Then what does the representation part in the representative democracy mean.

> So when a democracy is representative, the minority's will can override the majority's will? Yes, and this is a feature, not a bug. Majority voting on issues one at a time cannot generate a deal that a majority would prefer when the compromise is presented as a block. Eg, if there are six different compatible single-issues that 10% of the people care solely about each, each individual one would get voted down 90-10…

What does compatible mean if they would get voted down 90-10?

Re: NY Sabotages Right to Repair Bill [video]

#156

Post by RobotToaster » Sat, Dec 31, 2022, 10:54 AM UTC

scifibestfi wrote: post #27

Gigachad wrote: post #21

What is the justification for being able to change the terms after the votes have taken place?

The government's #1 excuse for anything they want to do without having to actually justify it: "Safety"

And what is "safe" just happens to be exactly what their corporate "donors" want.

Re: NY Sabotages Right to Repair Bill [video]

#157

Post by lotsofpulp » Sat, Dec 31, 2022, 10:56 AM UTC

ThrustVectoring wrote: post #111

unity1001 wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "tyranny of masses" That's democracy. If you water down or prevent the democratic will through ANY means to empower the will of the minority over the majority for ANY reason, then you end up implementing the governance of an elite. Minority rights of the people are a different matter - they would be guaranteed by the civil law governing human rights in a country - they dont have anything to do with the democratic w…

Pure majoritarianism isn't necessarily best either, it just always takes the majority's side in disputes where a strongly-held minority opinion comes in conflict with a weakly-held majority one. Like, it's obvious that you should take the side of the majority when it's "we'd rather not be slightly inconvenienced by paying for rent-seekers" regardless of how intensely the minority of rent-seekers want to rent-seek, bu…

> but it's much less obvious that we should have zero handouts to narrow interests when it's "please spend $10000 per life saved via rare-disease research and treatment, I don't care how little the general public is aware of and cares about it and would generally prefer lower taxes"

In reality, this turns into we should have billion dollar handouts to narrow interests because rather than use taxpayer funds to R&D cures into the public domain using the existing world class university system, the narrow interests would prefer being able to benefit from patented medicines:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/drug-prices-reach-new-highin-th...

> Since August, U.S. or European health regulators have approved four new products intended as one-time treatments for rare genetic diseases that carry list prices of at least $2 million a patient, including two from Bluebird Bio Inc.

Re: NY Sabotages Right to Repair Bill [video]

#158

Post by hulitu » Sat, Dec 31, 2022, 10:59 AM UTC

Ekaros wrote: post #126

smnrchrds wrote: post #44

I believe the analysis. Here in Canada, the government passed a law not that long ago (during the pandemic) to enshrine rights of passengers for delayed and cancelled flights, which included right to specific amounts of monetary compensation in those scenarios. The law, however, had an exception, where no compensation is due if the flight is delayed or cancelled due to a safety issue. Lo and behold, the airlines have…

We need some 3-strike rules for companies. Three 3-strikes like wrong reasons used and you are permanently out. Your property is confiscated and sold, wages are paid out, any debtors are paid if there is any money and rest is forfeited as penalty to state.

Haha. As long as lobying is legal this will not happen.

The laws are basicaly made by those companies.

Re: NY Sabotages Right to Repair Bill [video]

#159

Post by scarface74 » Sat, Dec 31, 2022, 11:01 AM UTC

subradios wrote: post #133

Ekaros wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We need some 3-strike rules for companies. Three 3-strikes like wrong reasons used and you are permanently out. Your property is confiscated and sold, wages are paid out, any debtors are paid if there is any money and rest is forfeited as penalty to state.

"Be a good person" is not a law I want anyone writing, because such a policy relies on the moral fortitude of random executive bureaucrats. "Wrong" reason is subjective. Tickets are nonrefundable because otherwise the network doesn't work, financially. Every hole in that increases costs far beyond the refunds themselves further down the line. Air travel is not a high margin, luxury product, it's a lot margin mass mar…

I fly a lot. But only on Delta and American. So I can’t speak to the other airlines. But they both have three tiers of tickets for the same main cabin seating. For Delta those are basic, main and main refundable.

Looking at a random domestic flight. The difference between the three tiers are about $30-$45 each.

Never buy Basic. But if you at least by the middle tier, while the tickets aren’t refundable, you can change the tickets without paying a fee or cancel a flight and get a credit that’s good for year.

The network works fine with people cancelling and changing flights all of the time.

Re: NY Sabotages Right to Repair Bill [video]

#160

Post by Linosaurus » Sat, Dec 31, 2022, 11:04 AM UTC

Buraksr wrote: post #34

Gigachad wrote: post #21

What is the justification for being able to change the terms after the votes have taken place?

My understanding is that it is more a consequence of politics than the system... Sure you have a veto proof majority on this bill, but what about what comes next? The governor is able to stop "tyranny of masses" by their veto power. Almost no bill in our partisan age is able to pass with a veto proof majority. So the governor has the ability to prevent good outcomes for specific members of their party in the legislat…

> 3.) Accept the governor's revisions and move the bill forward

Nice write up, but leaves me wondering how this works formally.

My main guesses:

1.) There will be a vote to formally accept the new changes, but it’s treated as a done deal.

2.) The governor can formally edit the text to say anything she wants, and it’s up to the legislature to protest afterwards.