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Americans duped into losing $10B by illegal Indian call centres in 2022: report

timesofindia.indiatimes.com

151–160 of 504 posts

Re: Americans duped into losing $10B by illegal Indian call centres in 2022: report

#151

To temper the potential for anti-indian rhetoric, US authorities work side by side with local Indian authorities to shut these down. Mark Rober has a few videos dedicated to going after several of these scam call centers, and most recently 3 major ones were shut down and their owners arrested.

I'm sorry but suggesting Mark Rober is helping to stop the scamming industry in India is like helping Ukraine by adding sprinkles to a cupcake at an elementary school bake sale.

The awareness is more helpful than you think, many people I know were only introduced to how massive that industry is because of Mark

Re: Americans duped into losing $10B by illegal Indian call centres in 2022: report

#152
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Operating in collusion with American carriers who don't try to identify and block these operations because they get paid on a per-call basis?

Is that the case? When I worked in telefony abuse, like this, was pretty hard to track because of all the middlemen involved. They'd have phone banks with multiple phone numbers that they'd lease from providers in India who worked with them to rotate through outbound numbers. India doesn't allow Americans telefony companies, much less voip (in order to provide these telefony companies business), so looking at India f…

We handled this in the days of email spam by blacklisting providers that refused to police their customers.

Re: Americans duped into losing $10B by illegal Indian call centres in 2022: report

#153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just hope your life partner doesn’t lock themselves out of the house and try to call you from a polite strangers phone.

I assume in the parent they still accept voicemails. I'm sure your partner would be aware of your policy of not picking up unknown numbers and think to leave a voicemail in this situation.

There's nothing my wife wants to hear more when she's stranded on the side of the road than "Please leave a message."

Re: Americans duped into losing $10B by illegal Indian call centres in 2022: report

#154
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Operating in collusion with American carriers who don't try to identify and block these operations because they get paid on a per-call basis?

Is that the case? When I worked in telefony abuse, like this, was pretty hard to track because of all the middlemen involved. They'd have phone banks with multiple phone numbers that they'd lease from providers in India who worked with them to rotate through outbound numbers. India doesn't allow Americans telefony companies, much less voip (in order to provide these telefony companies business), so looking at India f…

What would happen if the American companies just started playing hardball? For example, what if they required that contracts with foreign telephone companies had a fee based on scams detected as coming through and just refused to work with any company that wouldn't agree to those terms? I have no idea if that exact idea would make sense or even be possible to implement, but my thinking is that in many cases the American companies might be able to afford to lose the business more than their international partners, so playing a game of chicken might be worthwhile. In other words, just because American telecoms might not be able to do anything from a technical perspective doesn't mean that they don't have social or business pressure they could apply if they actually wanted to solve the problem. Ultimately, it seems like the American companies haven't done anything because they don't really have any business incentive to; as long as they aren't held culpable legally and don't lose sales due to the PR hit, trying to use their influence to solve this is purely a risk from a financial perspective.

I don't at all subscribe to the Friedman perspective that businesses are ethically obligated to maximize profits at the expense of literally everything else, but I do think that it's a reasonable description of the way businesses trend toward acting; an entity structurally designed for making profits will inevitably end up acting in a way that only considers that measure unless the incentives are changed, which is precisely why we _do_ need to regulate things to curtail business behavior that's a net bad for society as a whole by making it unprofitable, whether that's through direct fines or making business liable either civilly or criminally for their actions.

Re: Americans duped into losing $10B by illegal Indian call centres in 2022: report

#155

I find that a majority of our incoming calls are scams. Surprised that Google/Apple haven’t fixed this at the behest of the government.

I have a convenient heuristic which I imagine is quite common. I have a cell phone with an area code from where I purchased it, but I have since moved, so all my local calls come from a different area code. Calls from my area code of residence are almost never spam, while calls from any other area code, and especially my phone's area code, are almost always spam.

I’m in Canada and a lot of my spam calls come from a number very similar to mine, with only the last 4 digits changed.

Re: Americans duped into losing $10B by illegal Indian call centres in 2022: report

#156

These operations have to be sponsored by the state at this scale. At the bare minimum they're at least looking the other way. My grandparents are the targets for this kind of scam, and when they call their bank they get an Indian customer service rep to discuss the situation with. Absolutely disgusting that the situation has been tolerated for so long.

They’re state sponsored at the local level. Local law enforcement is underpaid and gets huge bribes from these call centers. At the national level India doesn’t have the law enforcement resources to stop it with local law enforcement working against them. It’s a mess.

Re: Americans duped into losing $10B by illegal Indian call centres in 2022: report

#157
post #25

Set your phone to silence unknown callers. Completely eliminated the issue for me, along with any other random goofball trying to call me.

Also caused me to completely miss an appliance delivery because the driver called me from his personal cell, I forgot I had "unknown callers" filtered, and he gave up when he couldn't reach me. Even though I get way more spam calls than legitimate calls, I realized that fully half of the legitimate calls I get are from numbers not in my contacts: delivery drivers, doctors offices, restaurants confirming reservations,…

And emergency calls of various kinds etc. Fortunately it's not so bad for me that I'm willing to make myself harder to reach for legitimate, and possibly important, purposes.

Re: Americans duped into losing $10B by illegal Indian call centres in 2022: report

#158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Telco's could put a stop to this if they really wanted to. Start with disabling number spoofing for international calls, if the number presented isn't in the country of origin then reject the connection request. Another choke point is the gift card system.

Edit: I was thinking of a totally different gift card scam. Whoops Gift cards should require some amount of destruction in order to get to the actual barcode… something to make tampering obvious. The same way clothes have a little ink exploder the clerk removes… just a quick easy step that is destructive to the packaging… but still presentable when you give it to someone

The scams work by getting the victim to send the codes to the scammer. They don’t care about the physical cards.

Re: Americans duped into losing $10B by illegal Indian call centres in 2022: report

#159
post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No they can't. The scammers will just hire a random person from indeed/monster/whatever, ship them a SIM box and tell them to fill it with prepaids.

no, not with that mindset. security is about creating obstacles. obstacles create friction and traces, even when they fail.

Using SIM boxes is already standard practice, sketchy VOIP providers and SMS spammers have been doing for years because it is cheaper to do this than to pay for legitimate routing.

Just put something along the lines of "sim box grey route" into Google and you'll find loads of relevant industry materials.

Besides, you're drastically moving the goalposts here. We went from "could put a stop to this" to minor obstacles.

Re: Americans duped into losing $10B by illegal Indian call centres in 2022: report

#160

These days whenever I hear Indian voice, I just reject call. They way they target grandparents is surreal. One day they told my my friends parents that their children is in accident and they have to pay in gift cards. It is so distressing to elderly people. US must take strict actions and call out India publicly. Elderly people are weak, education isn't going to solve the scam problem. Scammers must be punished harsl…

I had to instruct my elderly father to do the same -- any kind of accent and he hangs up. He got scammed by one of these people in 2018 or so -- he gave the person his debit card number over the phone to remove malware on his computer while I was out on a super-long run. Luckily he couldn't remember his PIN, and his bank was great at blocking the charge. There's a special place in hell for these animals who prey on o…

These days I’d recommend just not answering any unrecognized number. If they’re waiting for a call for some specific reason, they can look at voicemail transcripts to see if it’s the call they were expecting and call back. Otherwise it’s best to ignore any incoming calls. Anything truly important won’t use a phone call as the only contact method.
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